To Dice or Not to Dice...

Hello Everyone: I wanted to bring up a question of game mechanics. I am
working on my own space combat game and I am considering the combat rules
mechanics. Recently a bunch of wargames and RPGs have come out using a
diceless
format.  I was wondering if there are any advantages/problems to this
kind of system?

Later,

> I wanted to bring up a question of game mechanics. I am working

I don't know anything about recent diceless game systems (been too busy with
RL to keep up) but the old WarpWar from decades back had a diceless combat
system (I'm not going to say it was the first, but it was one of the few; the
only one I knew of back then, anyway) that worked fairly well. It was based on
your current speed, your opponent's current speed, your combat tactic (attack,
dodge, retreat) and your opponent's combat tactic. Didn't have many people
interested in playing it back then (most everyone
I knew was into Starfire ;-) but the few games I did get in worked okay.

Mk

well.. there is the question of how one generates random effects without a
random effects generator...

or is this a system of chits and the like drawn from a cup?

> Hello Everyone:

> On Fri, 10 Jan 1997, Mark A. Siefert wrote:

> Hello Everyone:

> Recently a bunch of wargames and RPGs have come out using a diceless
The advantage/disadvantage is tat you can more accurately predict
results, i.e. cruiser vs. destroyer will generate exactly this result this
percentage of the time vs a more amorphous prediction with the random factor
added in. Diceless systems tend to eliminate long shots and I believe that
games are more predicable. Critical ammo explosions or mass decapitations
become extinct. I think that randomness adds a little more flavor to a game
system. Think of all the games, history,
that a team/side/ country as "overcome" the odds and won a victory.

> At 02:45 PM 1/10/97 -0600, you wrote:
I don't particualarly care for diceless systems. I always feel that if you
know what is going to happen, why play the game? I like that chance of failure
even when you are all but guarantied victory of that "if I can get a 6 I'll
hurt you". That's part of the game for me. Guess that's why I don't play
chess.

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> On Fri, 10 Jan 1997, Pretty for January wrote:

> I don't know anything about recent diceless game systems (been too

Note that there _is_ a 'random' element in this - namely the fact that
you don't know what combat tactic your opponent will use!

In fact, the few diceless combat game systems I've seen have all had this
factor instead - sort of an advanced 'paper-rock-scissors' game, with
combat modifiers. It only gets predictable if you have a massive advantage
yourself (in which case it'd be predictable even with dice), or if you can
predict what option your opponent will use.

Regards,

> At 02:45 PM 1/10/97 -0600, you wrote:

In my experience, WarpWar is a diceless system.   It is a variation of
Rock, Paper, Sissors. This limits what you can do, unless you have something
else in mind.

> Binhan Lin wrote:

> or mass decapitations become extinct. I think that randomness adds a

I agree.  I enjoy the true random element in a dice-based system.  I
tried a diceless system once and became tired really fast of all the silly
lookup tables.