this is a first...

Well, this has got to be a first. The past two nights here in the U.S. the
SciFi channel showed their miniseries, "Battlestar Galactica", and *no* one
has posted any comments or commentary on the space combat sequences!

Mk

Mark,

This hasn't been due to lack of interest or ideas... I've been holding back,
not wanting to spoil it for anyone who didn't have a chance to see it yet.

They are showing both parts back to back again this weekend.

> --- Indy <kochte@stsci.edu> wrote:

Wait 'till my lunch break.....

> Stuart Ford wrote:

Could always pad the email with spoiler warnings and spaces. :-)

I don't think a lot of the space combat was a giveaway to anything. They
addressed pseudo real physics by using reaction thrusters on the Vipers rather
than doing it Cinematic and having them emmulate planes in space. I haven't
had a chance to *really* examine the combat sequences in detail yet, so not
sure if they got it all right or not. But the overall story is gelling some
scenario ideas in me
for ECC 8.  ;-)

Some of the combat footage was pretty cool, but other parts were jerky to me.
I understand they were trying to give you the feel for *being* *right* *there*
in the battle, but...deep space battles won't generate the same concussive
forces as combat in an atmosphere will. That was most distracting [for me]
when the Galactica was firing her weapons (but ymmv).

Mk

> --- Indy <kochte@stsci.edu> wrote:

> I don't think a lot of the space combat was a

Not at all. But I did enjoy the combat sequences, I
felt they had a more up-to-date FX quality, while
retaining the flavor of the original series. And while the Cylons get a
makeover, I was glad that the Vipers look like, well, Vipers.

> They addressed pseudo real physics by using reaction

I noticed a couple of other "homages" to vector, particularly when a Cylon
flips and faces backwards as it's still flying the opposite direction.

I haven't had a chance to *really*
> examine the

Yeah, I've already been asking myself how to model them in FT and DS. In DS 2,
The Vipers had some sort of MDC, probably a set of MDC 2's. I'd also add a
Superior PDS, just to reflect the defensive fire capability as shown in the
show.

> Some of the combat footage was pretty cool, but

I actually liked the way the combat was filmed, but I suppose it is a
subjective preference thing....

> That was most distracting [for me] when the

The only time I saw the Galactica firing, I just
wroite the jetking off as recoil -- that will still be
there, even in space.

> This hasn't been due to lack of interest or ideas... I've been holding

For which I'm MOST grateful; not having cable, I'm waiting on a friend who'll
share this weekend.

Mind you, I'm still grousing about Starbuck and Boomer getting gender
changes...

The_Beast

> Doug Evans wrote:

Oooohhhh, wait until you see$@##**(^R^R^R^R

<static>

Sorry. Transmission interrupted at the source due to Cylon jamming. Code
Orange Four. Please send all available Colonial Vipers to assist. Thank you.

> At 12:34 PM -0600 12/10/03, Doug Evans wrote:

But they're cute. Especially Boomer. Cute mousy asian chicks....yum. I'm not
sure I like cigar smoking chicks however...

I did in fact like the combat scenes rather well. The depth of field was
interesting and I liked how shots of ships that were fleeting were kind of
like the view one would have if tracking with some kind of optical sensors.
Their use of lingo and terminology was pretty nice as well.

> --- Doug Evans <devans@nebraska.edu> wrote:

> Mind you, I'm still grousing about Starbuck and

I found it weird too, but it worked.

> --- Ryan M Gill <rmgill@mindspring.com> wrote:

> But they're cute. Especially Boomer. Cute mousy

Boomer was cute, yes, but Starbuck... there's something hot about a woman who
can kick your arse....

> I did in fact like the combat scenes rather well.

I agree.

Mark,

This hasn't been due to lack of interest or ideas... I've been holding back,
not wanting to spoil it for anyone who didn't have a chance to see it yet.

They are showing both parts back to back again this weekend.

Stuart

Same here, I'm going to wait till the weekend to comment.

Even more importantly than thrust vector Vipers, and missile carrying Cylon
raiders, and whether or not its a good idea for Starbuck to go to war in drag,
is the THEME TUNE as good as in the original series?

And does anyone know when it will get to the UK?

Regards,

> Brian B wrote:

There's a woman here who could kick your arse w/out breaking
a sweat...but trust me, nothing hot about her.  ;-)

Mk

You actually get to hear the original theme tune, but I won't say when, it'll
spoil things...

> --- Matt Tope <mptope@omnihybrid.com> wrote:

YAY!!!

[quoted original message omitted]

> Matt Tope wrote:

And we won't say when Muffit appears, either.

;-)

Mk

> -----Original Message-----

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!
!!

[quoted original message omitted]

YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYY!!!

(I'll stop this now, but somehow I hadn't heard that Battlestar Galactica had
been remade until you guys mentioned it, and whilst I'm not keen on most of
the original series or the follow on series I have always felt that the
opening episodes were some of the finest screen combat Sci-fi around)

Regards,

Matt Tope

PS (and the old theme tune rocked!)

[quoted original message omitted]

> --- Indy <kochte@stsci.edu> wrote:

Nor how many people shoot him all at once.... J/K

> --- Indy <kochte@stsci.edu> wrote:

> There's a woman here who could kick your arse w/out

OK, so let me rephrase that. "There's something about an attractive woman who
can also kick your butt that makes her seem that much more attractive."

> At 9:09 AM -0800 12/11/03, Brian B wrote:

Im sure John A can hook you up with some Army Fem types.

> --- Ryan Gill <rmgill@mindspring.com> wrote:

My wife might not approve of that, and since she fits my description above,
I'll pass, thanks....

> Brian B wrote:

Nor how the invincible Muffit saves the ship and show yet again.

;-D

Mk
(okay, this is getting silly ;-)

> --- Indy <kochte@stsci.edu> wrote:

Getting? It went there as soon as the stupid dog got mentioned.

> --- Indy <kochte@stsci.edu> wrote:

Having just got the Firefly DVD set and watched some of the extras,
Zoe (Gina Torres) springs obviously to mind in this context....  ;-)

A bit in the blooper reel with Zoe and Wash laughing their heads off in one of
their "bedroom scenes" is wonderful.....

Jon (GZG)

> =====

> On Thu, 11 Dec 2003, Indy wrote:

> Matt Tope wrote:

Dear god, no.

> Getting? It went there as soon as the stupid dog got

That's a daggit, dag nab bit...

Sillier than thee? That's me!

> Having just got the Firefly DVD set and watched some of the extras,

Of previous show which I shall not dignify mentioning by name, she was the
most interesting. As for Firefly, twas not my favorite show of what could have
been, but US TV has kept far worse for years. I look forward to chuckling over
the scenes you're mentioning.

The_Beast

> --- Doug Evans <devans@nebraska.edu> wrote:

Dag, dog, daggit, rabbit, this thread is getting to be a habit.

> >Having just got the Firefly DVD set and watched

?????

she was the
> most interesting. As for Firefly, twas not my

I liked it, enjoyed the old west/Sci Fi flavor....

Re: Gina Torres

> ?????

As I thought, this WAS a job for IMDB!

However, as a side-thingy, IMDB has Firefly the movie labled as 'in
production'. Does anyone know if that's actually beyond pre-production?
Film running through cameras?

The_Beast

> --- Doug Evans <devans@nebraska.edu> wrote:

Ah, yes, thanks. I assume you're referring to the unnamed one that includes a
year in the title? Although a couple others in the list are bad, just not THAT
bad....

> However, as a side-thingy, IMDB has Firefly the

Oh, please let it be true.....

> Doug Evans wrote:

The word on alt.tv.firefly is that the script hasn't yet been written, and
production depends on the script being approved.

The more DVDs bought, the more approvable the script may be.

Ah but you see, the Muffy daggit will be the ultimate Cylon agent. Who would
suspect a cute little dog of being a robot.

Eli
[quoted original message omitted]

> Ah but you see, the Muffy daggit will be the ultimate Cylon agent. Who

But anything that annoying will be DFFG'd anyway so it wouldn't be a *good*
agent

> On Fri, Dec 12, 2003 at 08:34:03AM -0800, staremu wrote:

You mean... the original wasn't?

> On Wed, Dec 10, 2003 at 01:43:24PM -0500, Ryan M Gill wrote:

> I did in fact like the combat scenes rather well. The depth of field

That sort of thing is starting to turn up a lot -- there were several
shots in "Firefly" where the focus drifted in and out before settling on ships
and they weren't dead centre, like they were being watched through long
lenses.

It's nice in a way -- it's an added realism, but on the other hand,
there isn't /SUPPOSED/ to be a cameraman focussing the camera...

That should have read as a "nobody would suspect the cute little dog of being
a bad guy." sorry..

Eli
[quoted original message omitted]

> Katie Lucas wrote:

It was, so I have read, the same company doing the effects for BG and Firefly.
According to messages on alt.tv.firefly a Firefly class ship appears on screen
for about three seconds of BG.

> --- Ground Zero Games <jon@gzg.com> wrote:

I never heard of Firefly when it was on, only seen ads for the DVD.

Is it any good?

I am suspicious of any sci-fi from the man who brought us "Buffy the
Vampire Slayer":)

J

> Jared Hilal wrote:

I liked "Buffy...". I didn't like "Firefly". I tried to give it a chance, but
I just couldn't deal with it. On this list, I think I'm in the minority on
that. So take that into consideration.

Mk

never heard of Firefly when it was on, only seen ads for the DVD.

Is it any good?

I am suspicious of any sci-fi from the man who brought us "Buffy the
Vampire Slayer":)

Think of Firefly as cross between Traveller and Gunsmoke, I liked some and
didn't care for some of the episodes. Over all it was enjoyable, with the
train robbery being the best.

I think people generally only like 2 of Joss Whedon's 3 series. I love Firefly
and Angel, but can't be bothered with Buffy.

May I recommend the DVD set as a rental?

> Don M wrote:

> never heard of Firefly when it was on, only seen ads for the DVD.

> On Sat, 13 Dec 2003 19:02:16 -0800, Michael Llaneza writes:

Well, I'm a big fan of all three. I'd probably put angel as the low man on the
totem pole, but only because someone has to be. If you like scifi, and the
idea of westerns in space doesn't turn you off, I'd recomend at least watching
a couple of episodes.

> On 13 Dec 2003 at 13:22, Jared Hilal wrote:

> I am suspicious of any sci-fi from the man who brought us "Buffy the

I've been buying the Buffy and Angel DVDs as they come out. I never got to see
6th or 7th season Buffy when it came out, and I missed 1 and a half seasons of
Angel. I preferred Angel to Buffy (it was less angst ridden), but I preferred
both to Firefly. Firefly was hard to find, it just never seemed to be on when
I had a chance to watch it. I was taping them, but then I eventually stopped.
There was just something about the American western frontier in space motif
that didn't quite grab me.

On the other hand, I've seen enough people here liking it that I may get the
DVDs. After all, it's not like I'll have to keep collecting them like Angel
and Buffy (and there are only three more season of Buffy yet to come out).

Of course if you don't like Buffy (and what's wrong with ya anyway? *duck*)
then you may not care for Firefly.

I'm with Matthew on this one.

I like all three series, and was greatly disappointed when Firefly was
cancelled.  It was well done - sure it had some "teething issues" as
with any new series; it would have been great to see how things settled out
over a full season or two, but it was pretty solid from the beginning.

The cast looked like they were having fun, and it had some fun, quirky
characters.

Very Traveller-ish.  Well, with a strong cowboy flavour.

The sci-fi channel here has been running it again through this season,
and they just finishted broadcasting the three (or four?) unaired episodes.
Good stuff.

The DVD set will be coming home, for sure!

> Adrian Johnson wrote:

The DVD set is on my Christmas wish list.   I hope to be watching
the series episodes on Christmas Day!

The series was left with a lot of unanswered questions and interesting
character quirks and issues.

> --- Allan Goodall <agoodall@att.net> wrote:

Never said I didn't enjoy watching "Buffy...", I just meant that having
seen these, I am suspisious of his vision for sci-fi.

Also, my enjoyment of "Buffy" and "Angel" has more to do with Kristy Swanson,
Allison Hannigan, Charisma Carpenter and Eliza Dushku:D and
a TiVo-bility to FFwd throught the teen angst :)

J

> Jared Hilal wrote:

> Never said I didn't enjoy watching "Buffy...", I just meant that having
Be *very* suspicious of his vision.

> Also, my enjoyment of "Buffy" and "Angel" has more to do with Kristy

You won't be disappointed, although the Firefly cast wasn't picked primarily
for eye candy as the Buffy cast was.

> Jared Hilal wrote:

Probably true, but they're still pretty damn good.... Kaylee (Jewel Stait) is
cute, Inara (Morena Baccarin) is exotically gorgeous, Zoe
(Gina Torres) is ass-kickingly gorgeous, and River (Summer Glau) is
cute but scary...... <grin>

And don't get me started on Saffron (from "Our Mrs.Reynolds", can't
recall the actress' name), who is truly of Willow-level cuteness....
<bigger grin>.

Oh, and the female viewers are catered for in "Trash" with a several
shots of Mal's backside.....  ;-)

Jon (GZG)

PS: there may or may not be a part-finished "Glow-Worm class"
transport ship in FT scale on my workbench at the moment....  ;-)

> --

> Ground Zero Games wrote:

> Probably true, but they're still pretty damn good.... Kaylee (Jewel

> --- Jon Davis <davisje@nycap.rr.com> wrote:

> > And don't get me started on Saffron (from "Our

And from Twin Falls? Wow.... I lived 6 miles from there as a boy.... should
have stayed....

> Ground Zero Games wrote:

Yep. Anyone else going to that "special hell"....?   ;-)

> PS: there may or may not be a part-finished "Glow-Worm class"

It may or may not (then, it may or may not exist in the first
place.....).

It's post-Xmas, so I'm watching my Firefly DVD set. Mmmm mmmm good. I'm
on disc four, and have now seen two of the unaired episodes and one I missed
first time around. Damn this show was good.

I can only conclude that the Fox execs responsible for the Friday 8pm schedule
and subsequent cancellation... never watched the frelling show.

It's worth a shot to rent the first disc, a lot of you can just add it to your
Netflix queue.

> Jared Hilal wrote:

> --- Allan Goodall <agoodall@att.net> wrote:

> On Thursday, January 1, 2004, at 09:54 AM, Michael Llaneza wrote:

> It's post-Xmas, so I'm watching my Firefly DVD set. Mmmm mmmm good.

Anyone know if there are any plans for a Region 2 version of the DVDs?

(Not that it'd get watched that fast as I've still got half of season 2 and
the whole of season 3 of Robin of Sherwood to work through).

Cheers,

> On Thursday, January 1, 2004, at 09:54 AM, Michael Llaneza wrote:

Apparently due "sometime in 2004, probably", according to SFX..... make of
that what you will.

I simply got the region 1 version via playUSA.com - £27.99 inc
shipping - because I didn't want to wait (and I have a multi-region
player).

Jon (GZG)

> (Not that it'd get watched that fast as I've still got half of

Living in Japan as I do, I often run into encoding issues. Check with your
local dealer about players manufactured by LG ELectronics of
Korea - mine is a top of the line model, handling DVD, CD and a few
other flavors, and comes with a "maintenance function" that allows the user to
switch it to any encoding, or encoding-free. Legal, too!
There are a couple websites listing all the models with this option and how to
access the "maintenance functions."

> Anyone know if there are any plans for a Region 2 version of the DVDs?

From: "Edward Lipsett (work)" <translation@intercomltd.com>

> Living in Japan as I do, I often run into encoding issues.

In Australia, we're in region 4, along with Brazil, Argentina etc. I'm sure
there's some logic there, but I don't know what it is.

This means that over 90% of DVDs don't get released here, and those that do
are often delayed a few months or years.

> From: "Edward Lipsett (work)" <translation@intercomltd.com>

All hail the american movie industry -_-

So order from Amazon with Region 1 (strange how the US is always "1" isn't
it?) and get it delivered in a week. Heck, I ordered Dog Soldiers from
Amazon.uk and got it in a week, and I doubt it will EVER be released in Japan
('Course, it is in a foreign
language - certainly not either English or Japanese - haven't quite
figured out what language it actually is...)

> In Australia, we're in region 4, along with Brazil, Argentina

The movies get made...

On Thu, 1 Jan 2004 17:51:26 -0800 "Sylvester" <Xveers@hotmail.com>
writes:
> From: "Edward Lipsett (work)" <translation@intercomltd.com>

From: "Edward Lipsett (work)" <translation@intercomltd.com>

> So order from Amazon with Region 1 (strange how the US is always "1"
isn't
> it?) and get it delivered in a week.

A very expensive coaster for those of us with region 4 (only) machines.

W:
> The movies get made...

The product must flow...

E:
> Check with your local dealer about players manufactured by LG

A:
> A very expensive coaster for those of us with region 4 (only) machines.

Fair's fair, he did imply you should get another machine IMMEDIATELY. You just
have to realize that anyone living in Japan probably feels that money
is never an object. ;->=

I know I'd starve to death there.

The_Beast

PS Isn't anyone going to go ballistic about the
language-in-the-Dog-Soldiers crack?

> Doug Evans wrote:

> PS Isn't anyone going to go ballistic about the
No

> Fair's fair, he did imply you should get another machine IMMEDIATELY.
You
> just have to realize that anyone living in Japan probably feels that

Money is always an object, but without being able to watch DVDs every so often
I'd probably do something I'd regret.

> PS Isn't anyone going to go ballistic about the

Yeah, I was sort of looking forward to it. Surely nobody is going to claim
that it's English, of all things...

> --- Alan and Carmel Brain <aebrain@webone.com.au> wrote:

The regions are a combination of factors. The two primary ones are language(s)
and video standards.

Region 1 (US, Canada, Mexico) use NTSC video signal and have English, French
and Spanish on most discs.

UK uses (I think) PAL video.

I think Japan has a seperate (3rd) video standard.

I am not sure about continental europe, SA, Australia, NZ, etc.

J

The link is a fairly good article on the whole region/standard issue. It
should explain most of it.

www.diabolikdvd.com/regionfree.htm

Tony Finan "I fix things, like cars, people, horse races."
Philcon 2003 - Media Operations www.philcon.org

[quoted original message omitted]

On or about Sat, Jan 03, 2004 at 06:59:38PM -0500, Tony Finan typed:
> The link is a fairly good article on the whole region/standard issue.
It
> should explain most of it.

It doesn't mention the "play on computer" option - there's software
which will get round region coding, macrovision, and those silly "disable
controls" settings too. This is increasingly looking like the best bet if you
have a machine fast enough to handle it.

I often wonder why they don't just do away with the entire "region code
system" entirely.

When a new movie comes out, release it to the ENTIRE PLANET at once...no

previews,  (fewer) leaked/illegal copies, bigger surprize for everyone.

Seems like a money maker to me...

Donald Hosford

> warbeads@juno.com wrote:

> The movies get made...

> On Tue, Mar 02, 2004 at 04:55:42AM -0500, Donald Hosford wrote:

> system" entirely.

Because films are still distributed on celluloid, which is expensive enough
that they generally can't afford enough prints for a simultaneous
world-wide release. And no cinema chain wants to show a film that's
already available to buy, even if you do have to order from overseas to get
it.

As it stands, the region code is a very low bar. Maybe I just move in
the wrong circles, but nobody I know face-to-face has any problem with
playing discs from any region he feels like... many dedicated players
are region-freeable these days, and any Windows computer with a DVD
drive can be unlocked with the DVD Region-Free software even if the
drive itself can't be re-flashed.

There is a push to eliminate the region system coming from all people,
Blockbuster Video. It seems that their video sales in the UK are being slammed
because they are contractually unable to sell any disk in that market that
isn't region 2. At the same time there are stores throughout the UK that are
selling nothing but Region 1 disks and making a killing as it is very easy to
get a region free machine in the UK.
   In the US, you can pick up a low end players like the Daewoo 3000-N
or the Cyberhome Ch-500, and make it region free by a few keystrokes on
the remote. Both have rather good PAL/NTSC converters built in. Both
players go for under $80 US. If people want more info, I can post links to
detailing how to make the changes, or contact me directly. Many low end DVD
players can have their setting reset, if you know the codes for the particular
machine.

Tony Finan "I've come to help you with your problems, so we can be free I'm
not a hero, I'm not a savior, forget what you know
I'm just a man whose circumstances went beyond his control"  - R.O.C.
Kilroy
[quoted original message omitted]

> Roger wrote:

> As it stands, the region code is a very low bar. Maybe I just move in

Considering how many people have problems resetting the clock on their VCR,
how many people have problems looking at an updated web page because they
can't clear their web browser's cache, and how many people can't be bothered
to read instructions if they aren't shown in big
pictures and no more than a page long, I suspect the bar isn't _that_
low. Sure, most of us here could watch DVDs in whatever region they want. For
the average consumer it's too much work... and they probably wouldn't go
looking for anything outside their own region anyway.

The region code will probably stay for the cinema reasons you mention, and
because the average person isn't going to bother finding away around it. The
average person doesn't even know what a region code is! I saw a post online
where someone didn't know what the "NTSC" code and "the little globe with the
number in it" meant on the back of their DVD. Region codes don't work with
everyone, but they work for the masses.

> On Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 10:18:23AM +0000, Roger Burton West wrote:

Erm. That's not the case these days.

We get UK production prints. Mostly because by the time they've been run 24x7
in a multiplex for a few weeks prints are **trashed**, so the US prints are
binned at the end of their run.

> Donald Hosford wrote:

One possible reason why they don't release in multiple languages worldwide
simultaneously is, localization into most languages isn't exactly cheap, and
simultaneous release makes it harder and more expensive.

Well...the US tresury has a simple solution to things like that...

They make a single "master" printing plate (or die) of a bill.
Then they use the master to make a "sub-master" die.
The sub master is then used to make 100 "working" dies. Working dies actually
print the money. Each working die is used until it is worn out. Then it is
distroyed. The operators just go back and get another working die, and keep
going.
When they run out of working dies, the same sub-master die is used to
make 100 more working dies.
When a sub-master is worn out, they distroy it, and make a new
sub-master from the master die.
Master dies are only replaced by recreating the die. And the whole long
process starts over...

This means that they can keep printing the same bill for a ludicrissly long
time.

If the movie industry did something similar, say only 5 sub-master
copies of the film. Then use these to make a "language master" for each of the
major languages.
Then use the language masters to run off all the working copies/DVDs
needed.

Home videos would be on DVD. Each copy would be cheap and perfect.

Sounds doable to me...

Donald Hosford

> Katie Lucas wrote:

> On Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 10:18:23AM +0000, Roger Burton West wrote:

Instead of paying to make the local versions later, they would just make

them all at once. Sounds like the same cost.

Donald Hosford

> Laserlight wrote:

> Donald Hosford wrote:

> Donald Hosford wrote:

If the movie flops, you don't pay to translate it into more languages. And if
you're doing it simultaneously, you need more project managers,
more QA people, etc--trust me, it's easier to do it sequentially than
simultaneously.