We recently played a game of DS2 and came up with a few questions for which we
couldn't find "official" answers. Any input would be appreciated.
1) When an Aerospace fighter/bomber attacks with Deadfall ordance is
there a "scatter" roll? If it drops more than one Load do they scatter
differently?
2) Are Aerospace fighters that fire direct fire weapons considered to be
attacking the top armor of a target? Do all terrain and other (dug-in,
smoke) defensive modifiers still apply?
3) Can ground units fire back at Aerospace units with regular direct fire
weapons (NOT LAD or ADS)? Can ground Units Opportunity fire against an
Aerospace Unit?
4) If an Aerospace Unit is attacking a ground Unit, can the defending player
use one of HIS fighters to attack the attacking Aerospace unit as an
Opportunity fire action?
5) Is guided missile fire effected by defensive terrain modifiers (such as
Woods, Dug-in, etc.)?
6) Smoke: The smoke rules state that Artillery, HELL, and DFFG fire will start
a fire in Woods or Urban areas. What is the effect of these flames on units?
If you have a Unit of infantry in a large (12" square) area of woods would
they have to leave? If so, when? What about a vehicle Unit?
7) Is firing a smoke discharger considered a firing action? In other words, if
an Element is moving at full speed can they fire their Smoke Dischargers at
the end of their move?
8) Opportunity Fire: Is it made on an Element level or Unit level? In other
words, if the attacker begins to move the Elements of a Unit when is
Opportunity fire actually declared? Does the Attacker finish moving all
Elements and then "back up" the ones the defender opportunity fires on or does
the defender have to announce his fire as each Element is moved?
[The
difference here is that, in the first case, a defender gets to see where an
attacker intends to move and then pick the best location/target to
shoot.
In the latter case, the defender must pick on the spot the Unit/loaction
and thus perhaps lose out on a good shot while waiting for a possible better
one.]
9) Infantry Close Assaults: If a defender has 10 infantry Elements (organized
into 5 squads) arranged in a line on a hill with 2" between squads and an
attacker makes a close assault on that Unit can the attacker "gang up" on just
one defending squad (2 Elements in this case) or do ALL defenders get to fire
on the attackers (assuming the Defender passes all Reaction rolls)?
Thanks!,
Some answers, as I understand them.
1) No idea, but a scatter for each Load would be realistic as no pilot in
their right mind would fly strait and level while their target was shooting at
them! 2) Yes they do attack the top armour of the target. (It's in the
Aerospace/VTOL design section on available weapons)
3) Not according to current rules, which is why you buy LAD/ADS systems.
4) Unknown, but Aerospace units are only on the board in their own activation
phase. 5) Can't help here, but do you want a target to roll 3 defensive dice?
6) As a suggestion, draw 1 chit per turn (cumulative) counting RED vs Infantry
& YELLOW vs Vehicles. (ie. 1 on 1st turn, 2 on the 2nd, 3 on the third, etc)
7) No help here, but maybe disallow firing them when moving over 1/2
rate. (ie. move slowly with cover, or move fast & get shot at.) 8) I use it on
a Unit level. A player moves the first vehicle & opportunity is declared at an
appropriate point. The rest of the unit is then arranged within normal
coherency & opportunity fire is resolved. It works fairly simply &
occasionally deadly.;) 9) Hard one to call, I'd say that all elements would
get to attack in the close assault as it's fairly representative. Anyway, if
you attacked a large unit of infantry with only a small one, you've got to
expect to
be wiped in return. :-)
> 1) When an Aerospace fighter/bomber attacks with Deadfall ordance ....
.....
> 9) Infantry Close Assaults: If a defender has 10 infantry Elements
> We recently played a game of DS2 and came up with a few questions for
Here goes - these should not be taken as "official" rulings, just as
ideas for guidance:
> 1) When an Aerospace fighter/bomber attacks with Deadfall ordance is
No, DSII "as written" has no scatter rolls for DFO - it is assumed they
are accurate enough given the compressed groundscale. If you wish, by all
means
introduce such a roll - especially if you want to do high-altitude
carpet-bombing (which will need some house rule tweaks anyway).
> 2) Are Aerospace fighters that fire direct fire weapons considered to
Yes, always on top armour. IMHO smoke should apply a modifier if it is very
close to the target (say within 2"?). Dug-in would probably not apply to
vehicles unless they had overhead cover.
> 3) Can ground units fire back at Aerospace units with regular direct
No, ground weapons can only fire at low-mode VTOLs; anything else is too
high/fast. LAD/ZAD have their own point in the turn sequence, so Opp.
fire doesn't apply.
> 4) If an Aerospace Unit is attacking a ground Unit, can the defending
No reason why not, IF you want to come up with some house rules for it. We
were originally going to have some CAP rules in DSII, but they were one of the
things chopped due to lack of space.
> 5) Is guided missile fire effected by defensive terrain modifiers (such
No.
> 6) Smoke: The smoke rules state that Artillery, HELL, and DFFG fire
Thgis is JUST A SUGGESTION (ie: untested!) - when such fires start,
place a fire marker (there are some on the SGII counter sheet if you have it,
otherwise improvise) either at the aim point (for DFFG, HEL etc) or a few
markers randomly scattered around the beaten zone (for Arty); any INFANTRY or
soft vehicle element has to move at least 2" from any marker, AFVs at least
1". Try it, fiddle with it and let me know!
> 7) Is firing a smoke discharger considered a firing action? In other
I think yes, and no respectively; you could say they would drive right through
their own smoke screen if moving fast.
> 8) Opportunity Fire: Is it made on an Element level or Unit level? In
[The
> difference here is that, in the first case, a defender gets to see
Bset to call Opp. fire when the first element of the group moves, then
immediately move all other elements approx. the same distance - after OF
resolution, then move all survivors the rest of their move.
> 9) Infantry Close Assaults: If a defender has 10 infantry Elements
This is tricky, because it really depends on the exact individual situation
(which is why we couldn't be more specific in the rules). If the defending
elements are all in what could be considered "one strongpoint", eg: along a
hill crest, or in one long trench) then the attackers should really be spread
out among them. If each small group of defenders are in a separate
clearly-defined position, then you could assault just one - but I think
in this case it would be fair to allow the other adjacent defending positions
some kind of enfilading opportunity fire at the attackers - house rule
time again!!
> Thanks!,
Hope this helps,
In a message dated 97-06-23 13:22:39 EDT, you write:
<< Yes, always on top armour. IMHO smoke should apply a modifier if it is very
close to the target (say within 2"?). Dug-in would probably not apply
to vehicles unless they had overhead cover. >>
I have to disagree with this one based on real-world military
experience. The Gulf War notwithstanding, tactical aircraft are virtually
useless
against dug-in vehicles (even without overhead cover) unless the
vehicles have been previously located or are emitting some easily detected
electronic signature.
Locating the vehicles could be done by ELINT or satellite photo or any of many
other variants of reconnaissance. But accurate information like that
applies only to static situations. Scenario-wise, if the defender had
been in position for a longish time, recon may have detected some positions
and hence they would be vulnerable to air attack (without modifiers). But it
is highly unlikely that unless the period of inactivity were longer than a
couple of days (which is about average for a deliberate attack) that recon
would be sufficient to negate the "dug-in" modifiers.
> On Mon, 23 Jun 1997 DirtSider@aol.com wrote:
> Locating the vehicles could be done by ELINT or satellite photo or any
Tactically, they would be tricky, thats what stealth systems are for. At
current, high tech systems can locate small targets using Acoustics, Radar
(millimetre wave), Target Emmisions (radar, infrared, radio, etc), and ground
vibrations.
The US and several other nations are working on systems that will locate
targets by looking for the air disturbances caused by their passage through
the air. Also by the emmision of waste products from propulsion.
If yo want to make your force of tanks hard to target pay for the steath. Just
saying that they are camoflaged won't cut it. I'll use millimeter wave radar.
So you use RAM over the hull and reduce the tank's RCS. You've just payed for
one or more levels of stealth.
> On Mon, 23 Jun 1997 DirtSider@aol.com wrote:
> applies only to static situations. Scenario-wise, if the defender had
Ohh, forgot to respond to the rest. You've been cranking these tanks up to
keep batteries charged right? Gotta run the systems on something right? I can
see the tanks with IR. LaDar will be able to detect the exhaust plumes. I
agree, its very hard to hide on a modern battlefield. If you take the time and
money you can do it, but there are always methods being developed to find you.
Don't underestimate the power of the mark I eyeball.
As a Suggestion re: Aerospace attacks, when using DFO, dropping multiple loads
could be treated as per artillery rules. This gives the option of annihilating
a single unit (closed sheaf) or suppressing an area (open Sheaf).