Hi All,
Please note that I didn't use turn length or complex physics formulas to come
up with this. I just looked for something playable and went with the flow.
Please comment and criticise, because I spent all of an hour or so coming up
with the entire system, and I'm sure it could use refinement.
System Thrust
Scale:
1 hex = 1/3 AU, or 3 hexes = 1 AU
Systems: Thus, the Sol system could be represented thusly: Sol(0), Mercury(1),
Venus(2), Earth(3), Mars(5), Jupiter(16), Saturn(29), FTL Limit(30),
Uranus(57), Neptune(90), Pluto(118) Where the number is the number of hexes
away from the main star (orbit ring: so Earth orbits in the ring of hexes
three out from the star). Though all planets are included for completeness,
you need only have out to the
FTL Limit on the game board. (Yes, I set 10AU/30 hexes arbitrarily; so
sue
me.)
Set-Up:
When setting up planets in their orbits, the owner of the system selects any
one planet and places it anywhere in its orbit ring. Then the opposing player
does the same with a planet of his choice, and they continue alternating.
(Yes, this is completely at odds with reality, but it should work for the
game!)
Movement: Ships move 1 hex per thrust point of their main drive. Groups of
ships may only move as fast as their slowest vessel.
Movement may either be free, plotted, or "double-blind," depending on
the group or the availability of a referee. For free movement, or movement
after detection. Move all ships one hex, alternating players, move all ships a
second hex, using the same method, etc. When a ship has moved a number of
hexes equal to its thrust, it has finished moving for the turn. Faster ships
will continue to move. If using plotted movement, switch to free movement when
a group is detected. A ship or group detected by one vessel is assumed to be
detected by all other units friendly to that vessel. (NO! I'm not going to
take time lag of communication into account at this scale.)
Combat: Ships in the same hex will engage in a FT combat on the tabletop.
Detection: Any transition into, or out of, FTL is immediately detected by all
ships, and the hex is marked. There are three levels of information: bogey,
mass, and all. Bogey tells the number of vessels in a group or hex. Mass tells
the mass of each vessel. All reveals the SSD. Sensors reveal a level of
information at a set range in hexes: All Mass Bogey Standard (Class 1) 0 2 4
Enhanced (Class 2) 0 4 8 Superior (Class 3) 0 6 12 Base (Class 4) 1 8 16 Base
(Class 5) 1 10 20 Base (Class 6) 1 12 24
Feel free to ignore classes 4-6 if you wish, or to set base ranges where
ever you want them. BTW, "All" is set at (.125)x("Mass" range), rounded down,
for those who want to create their own classes of sensors. Class 6 is the
greatest resolution possible, no matter how large the base or station.
Play and have fun.
> Sean Bayan Schoonmaker wrote:
> Hi All,
(snipped.)
> System Thrust
Could a turn be a few hours long? (I know some will ask this...me too.)
> Systems:
(snipped)
> ring: so Earth orbits in the ring of hexes three out from the star).
Though
> all planets are included for completeness, you need only have out to
The arbitrary FTL limit is fine. You could give a rating to sol's size, (like
1-10, with sol being say 5) then use a simple multiplier for the FTL
limit. (my example Sol's would be 6 x 5 = 30 hexes.
> Set-Up:
Or use dice rolls to place the planets.
> Movement:
(snipped)
> by all other units friendly to that vessel. (NO! I'm not going to take
I agree with you. Figuring in com lag would be something only the deturmined
would attempt.
> Combat:
Retreating ships would retreat back the system map in the proper hex.
> Detection:
(Snipped)
> Play and have fun.
All in all, a good simple system. (Just the way I like my rules!)
Now it needs random system generation, and it would make a fine addition the a
Strategic Product. (hint, hint Jon (GZG))
> down, for those who want to create their own classes of sensors.
I like this, sounds like some fun. I'll have a play.
As an aside, I have a utility (Win32) I wrote which will print large hex maps
with contiguous numbering over multiple sheets of paper. Perfect for this
little game system. If anyone is interested let me know by private
e-mail.
Dan
> System Thrust
My main comment, Schoon, is that if you'd waited another 24 hours to write
this, I'd have published first...which brings up Lobachevski and the whole
Lehrer thread again.
> Scale:
I'm inclined to use 1/4 AU per hex (1 day thrusting at 1
gee) or 1 AU/hex (2 days thrusting at 1 gee)--you picked 1/3
AU to get nice orbital rings for Mercury & Venus, I expect? Of course, if you
assume artificial gravity and high gee
thrust--which I thik is the canon assumption--then you can
pitch my preference out, as it's built on 1 gee thrust.
> FTL Limit(30), Uranus(57), Neptune(90), Pluto(118)
For Weber-philes, Basilisk Station stated that for a G0
star, the FTL limit is 22 light minutes out, which is IIRC about 2.6 AU.
Presumably that varies with the mass of the star.
> For free movement, or movement after detection. Move all
Or you could use something like the Champions speed chart, in which there are
segments: Speed Two moves on segment 6 and 12; Speed 3 moves on 4, 8, and 12;
Speed 4 on 3, 6, 9, and 12; speed 5 IIRC is 3, 5, 8, 10 and 12; and speed 6 is
2 4 6 8 10 12. I don't recall what speed 7 and 8 use but it shouldn't be too
hard to extrapolate.
> Combat:
Using their relative position and speed from the Strategic Game.
> Detection:
May need to refine this a little as ships will be jumping
in-system in smaller increments, and the defender may have
time to see one jump (and know there's someone coming) while the aggressor is
making another jump. I'd also like to establish a "preferred lane" coming from
one system to another, so if you're arriving at Alarish from Huy Braseal, you
arrive with a vector of, say, 2 in Direction 4 (of
six)--therefore to cut down on your thrust required and
transit time, you usually arrive on Hex Face 1 of the System Hex, so your exit
vector is taking you in the desired direction for free. This will I think help
ease the defender's problems a little.
> There are three levels of information: bogey, mass, and
Apparent mass after adjustments for Stealth and Weasels.
And you'd want to have something whereby a powered-down
ship, or sufficiently stealthed, wouldn't necessarily be detected. That would
probably require a referee, I suppose.
> Could a turn be a few hours long? (I know some will ask this...me
Just so you know what I was working with: I assumed there were 10 turns in a
day, each turn approximately 2.5 hours long.
So 1 turn = 10 FT turns
> The arbitrary FTL limit is fine. You could give a rating to sol's
Simply use Sol as a "base unit" and figure other stars in comparison. I was
just looking to get the base system down.
> When setting up planets in their orbits, the owner of the system
I thought about this, but I couldn't think of an easy way to do it.
Suggestions?
> Retreating ships would retreat back the system map in the proper hex.
Exactly. Great idea! Direction you leave the tabletop is the hex you retreat
into.
> Now it needs random system generation, and it would make a fine
Works for me ;-)
> Sean Bayan Schoonmaker wrote:
> >Could a turn be a few hours long? (I know some will ask this...me
So you could keep track of the number turns a battle takes. Divid it by 10,
and then let that many "system turns" pass before the combatants can take
another system turn.
> >The arbitrary FTL limit is fine. You could give a rating to sol's
I was
> just looking to get the base system down.
Looks good so far. My idea is just an example...
> >Or use dice rolls to place the planets.
You could roll a 6-sider to place each planet. Or a 12-sider to allow
more variablity.
> >Retreating ships would retreat back the system map in the proper hex.
I am gonna haveta give this thing a try sometime.
> Donald Hosford wrote:
Or count 10 and do another grand scale turn. Can we say "reinforcements"?
The problem being I've never seen a game go 10 turns. 7 is about the max.
> My main comment, Schoon, is that if you'd waited another 24
Sorry ;-)
> I'm inclined to use 1/4 AU per hex (1 day thrusting at 1
Exactly what I did.
> Of course, if you assume artificial gravity and high gee
Yup, right again. I was working with canon, though truth be told, I was
looking more at making it workable without caring about the physics
(gasp).
> Or you could use something like the Champions speed chart,
I thought about this, and would be willing to put it in if that's what people
want, but it smacked too much of SFB. I was looking for simple, simple,
simple.
> Combat:
Excellent point. I'll add it in.
> May need to refine this a little as ships will be jumping
Keep in mind that this is for "in system" use, so there shouldn't be any
jumps while on the board. I didn't work out any stellar-scale stuff.
That's
after I hash this out :-)
> Apparent mass after adjustments for Stealth and Weasels.
Sure, that's possible; like I said, this is the bare bones here. I want to
hammer out the basics before I go for the bells and whistles.
> And you'd want to have something whereby a powered-down
Bingo.
> So you could keep track of the number turns a battle takes. Divid it
Exactly.
> I thought about this, but I couldn't think of an easy way to do it.
I've seen the 12 sider method used before. It would work, but does limit
placement. I like the "choosing" method because it keeps anyone from getting
worked by the dice. Everyone has a chance to put this where they want them.
> Or you could use something like the Champions speed chart,
How about this:
10 Phases per system turn (each corresponding to 1 FT turn) with a phased
chart like you suggest.
That way a battle might start on phase 3, and reinforcements might arrive on,
say, phase 9. That way it translates directly over to FT!!
> Sean Bayan Schoonmaker wrote:
> How about this:
How about dirt simple: It takes one stratigic move to reach the EOS (Edge of
System) to Jump from any point in the system. It takes one stratigic move to
reach any planet from any other planet in the system. Battles are fought in
Tacitical time, there is no relationship between stratigic and tacitical time.
Bye for now,
John Leary wrote in reply to Schoon:
> > 10 Phases per system turn (each corresponding to 1 FT turn) with a
What? You mean you don't like the Starfire system/interception scale
movement rules? Shame on you! <G>
(much snippage)
> May need to refine this a little as ships will be jumping
while
> the aggressor is making another jump. I'd also like to
I think I was referring to the attacker _arriving_
in-system. He should have only a limited choice of
directions to arrive from without tipping off the defender he's coming,
because the defender will see the Jump Event A while the attacker is making
Jump B and C to get around the system. (This isn't necessarily valid, though,
as you could just do your circling at long range eg 1 light year out). I want
to limit the number of directions an attacker can approach from.
> I think I was referring to the attacker _arriving_
I think that's perfectly reasonable, but it does involve the next scale up.
For the moment, I think I'll let it be.
> Roger Books wrote:
> Or count 10 and do another grand scale turn. Can we say
Hehehehe. I can think of some battles where this would have been great!
> The problem being I've never seen a game go 10 turns. 7 is about the
> Sean Bayan Schoonmaker wrote:
> >So you could keep track of the number turns a battle takes. Divid it
I see your point. Very good.