> Jim 'Jiji' Foster wrote:
There was also a plastic cow looking on.
Has anyone ever strapped a Command Detonated Mine onto a randomly (or
partially randomly) moving object (ie, animal)? [I would never use my rabbits
for this, though]. Even a vehicle. Car bomb, anyone?
Didn't the US Navy use dolphins for a similar purpose in the 50s,
or is that just anti-US apocrypha?
Aside from the obvious ethical issues, wouldn't this be a handy way to send
someone a nice surprise? I can see human beings doing
this to non-indigenous life forms with nary a quibble.
What about KV prisoner exchanges with subcutaneous CDMs? Or even nukes?
Subject: Re: [SG] Wandering mines (was: NAC SAS rescues hostage.
. .)
Has anyone ever strapped a Command Detonated Mine onto a randomly (or
partially randomly) moving object (ie, animal)? [I would never use my rabbits
for this, though]. Even a vehicle. Car bomb, anyone?
Didn't the US Navy use dolphins for a similar purpose in the 50s,
or is that just anti-US apocrypha?
Aside from the obvious ethical issues, wouldn't this be a handy way to send
someone a nice surprise? I can see human beings doing
this to non-indigenous life forms with nary a quibble.
What about KV prisoner exchanges with subcutaneous CDMs? Or even nukes?
Paul
Hmmm, there are the WWII Russian dogs with satchel charges attached... They
were discontinued since they had trained with Russian equipment and the German
tanks had different sounds and smells, so the dogs would keep coming back to
the Russian lines to find familiar scents and sounds...
Talk about boomerangs...
--Binhan
> Paul Lesack wrote:
> Has anyone ever strapped a Command Detonated Mine onto a randomly
Russia, in WWII. Dogs, anti-tank mines, and improper training
methods--the dogs hid under tanks and blew up, alright. They just went
for Russian tanks (just like the ones in training) instead of German ones.
Program cancelled.
> Paul Lesack wrote:
> John Atkinson wrote:
> Russia, in WWII. Dogs, anti-tank mines, and improper training
Sweden, during and after WWII. Same basic idea, but IIRC our dogs were
trained on Soviet tanks <g> My great-uncle used to have one of those
mine dogs, but both he and it died long before I was born.
Later,
> Oerjan Ohlson wrote:
> > > Has anyone ever strapped a Command Detonated Mine onto a >
Incendiary Bats.
Were to be used by the USAAF in WW2. Basically, the Bats froze at high
altitude, so when dropped just.... dropped. End of Project. The idea was they
would roost in eaves, etc. Small incendiary device attached.
> At 00:42 03/02/99 +0100, you wrote:
SNIP
> John Atkinson wrote:
The story of the boomeranging Soviet mine-dogs comes from German
sources, and I think it's dodgy for a couple of reasons. Firstly, the Germans
shot
every dog they found on the offchance it was a mine-dog, which doesn't
sound like the reaction to a comical Soviet mistake. Secondly, the Red army
persisted with it from late '41 to '43, and would surely have spotted the
problem fairly early on(!). They claimed 12 German tanks killed by dogs at
Kursk. The main reason for ditching the idea appears to be the change from
defence to offence in '43.
More on-topic: I recall a proposed "smart mine" consisting of a sphere
with an explosive charge, rockets to hurl it in the right direction and a MAD
to let it find tanks. It would have bowled around the battlefield until it ran
into a target, then exploded. The biggest theoretical problem was the huge
number of false targets.
Rob
Subject: Re: [SG] Wandering mines (was: NAC SAS rescues hostage. . .)
> Paul Lesack wrote:
> Has anyone ever strapped a Command Detonated Mine onto a randomly
Russia, in WWII. Dogs, anti-tank mines, and improper training
methods--the dogs hid under tanks and blew up, alright. They just went
for Russian tanks (just like the ones in training) instead of German ones.
Program cancelled.
John M. Atkinson<<
Program was cancelled because the Red Army got proper AT weapons, not because
the dogs blew up friendly tanks. If you have your own tanks on the battlefield
to handle enemy armor, why bother with dogs anyway. And it is not as if the
Soviets had a shortage of captured German tanks to practice on.
As a side note, the Soviet military trained their dogs to attack tanks even in
the 80's.
In a message dated 99-02-02 16:26:36 EST, you write:
<< There was also a plastic cow looking on.
Has anyone ever strapped a Command Detonated Mine onto a randomly (or
partially randomly) moving object (ie, animal)? [I would never use my rabbits
for this, though]. Even a vehicle. Car bomb, anyone? XXXX The US army was
working on an idea of bouncing mines, ones that would bound about from place
to place on the battle field, once it got near a matalic object it would
exsplode. XXXX Didn't the US Navy use dolphins for a similar purpose in the
50s,
or is that just anti-US apocrypha?
XXXX They used Dolphins for placing mines on ships and as recon units.
XXXX
Aside from the obvious ethical issues, wouldn't this be a handy way to send
someone a nice surprise? I can see human beings doing
this to non-indigenous life forms with nary a quibble.
What about KV prisoner exchanges with subcutaneous CDMs? Or even nukes?
Paul >> I don't think that HQ would like that, if any more people got taken
prisoner you would never get them back.
-Stephen
> Alan E & Carmel J Brain wrote:
> On 3 Feb 99, at 17:06, Rob Paul wrote:
> The story of the boomeranging Soviet mine-dogs comes from German
Remember this is the same German army that covered tanks in Zimmerit, when the
russians didn't actually have any magnetic anti tank grenades;)
> Rob Paul wrote:
I recall a proposed "smart mine" consisting of a sphere with
> an explosive charge, rockets to hurl it in the right direction and a
I remember seeing this monstrosity on a PBS documentary back in 1990 or
so. It sort of looked like one of the old-style naval mines (the ones
with the triggers sticking out all over them) except that in this case, they
were small rocket venturies. It was basically spherical, and looked to be
about 3 feet across.
They showed a film of a test run. The thing started out by either being
air-dropped or launched from some sort of catapault (they were
considering both methods). It rolled and bounced its way across the
test range until it got stuck in a trench. The on-board computer,
having detected that it was no longer moving, then fired the lowest of the
rockets, sending the thing bouncing back up out of the trench and across the
field again, spitting fire periodically any time it paused. It traced a very
erratic course around the field, looking for any large, magnetic target (like
a tank). When it finally found one, it blew up (and apparently packed quite a
large warhead).
I can't say it looked like the most efficient way to kill tanks, but it should
make a great terror weapon. It looked quite terrifying as it bounced around,
constantly changing direction, spurting fire. And although you typical trooper
isn't magnetic, it was more than big enough to crush him. I don't see how you
could use it anywhere near friendly forces, though.
Ye Gods! It sounds like someone in the Defense Department thinks like GW style
Space Orks!
(but why do I not find that surprising?)
Jonathan Jarrard <jjarrard@ford.com> on 02/05/99 10:46:28 AM
Please respond to gzg-l@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU
To: gzg-l@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU
cc: (bcc: Jared E Noble/AAI/ARCO)
Subject: Re: [SG] Wandering mines (was: NAC SAS rescues hostage. . .)
> Rob Paul wrote:
I recall a proposed "smart mine" consisting of a sphere with
> an explosive charge, rockets to hurl it in the right direction and a
I remember seeing this monstrosity on a PBS documentary back in 1990 or
so. It sort of looked like one of the old-style naval mines (the ones
with the triggers sticking out all over them) except that in this case, they
were small rocket venturies. It was basically spherical, and looked to be
about 3 feet across.
They showed a film of a test run. The thing started out by either being
air-dropped or launched from some sort of catapault (they were
considering both methods). It rolled and bounced its way across the
test range until it got stuck in a trench. The on-board computer,
having detected that it was no longer moving, then fired the lowest of the
rockets, sending the thing bouncing back up out of the trench and across the
field again, spitting fire periodically any time it paused. It traced a very
erratic course around the field, looking for any large, magnetic target (like
a tank). When it finally found one, it blew up (and apparently packed quite a
large warhead).
I can't say it looked like the most efficient way to kill tanks, but it should
make a great terror weapon. It looked quite terrifying as it bounced around,
constantly changing direction, spurting fire. And although you typical trooper
isn't magnetic, it was more than big enough to crush him. I don't see how you
could use it anywhere near friendly forces, though.
In a message dated 99-02-05 15:59:27 EST, you write:
<< I remember seeing this monstrosity on a PBS documentary back in 1990 or
so. It sort of looked like one of the old-style naval mines (the ones
with the triggers sticking out all over them) except that in this case, they
were small rocket venturies. It was basically spherical, and looked to be
about 3 feet across.
They showed a film of a test run. The thing started out by either being
air-dropped or launched from some sort of catapault (they were
considering both methods). It rolled and bounced its way across the
test range until it got stuck in a trench. The on-board computer,
having detected that it was no longer moving, then fired the lowest of the
rockets, sending the thing bouncing back up out of the trench and across the
field again, spitting fire periodically any time it paused. It traced a very
erratic course around the field, looking for any large, magnetic target (like
a tank). When it finally found one, it blew up (and apparently packed quite a
large warhead).
I can't say it looked like the most efficient way to kill tanks, but it should
make a great terror weapon. It looked quite terrifying as it bounced around,
constantly changing direction, spurting fire. And although you typical trooper
isn't magnetic, it was more than big enough to crush him. I don't see how you
could use it anywhere near friendly forces, though. >> It was on a program
called Horizens (I know that I don't have the spelling corect) another weapon
that was on it was a sub munishion weapon that would move over the battle
field, when it got over a thermal source it would fire a charge that would
shape part of the weapon into a KEP and blow a nice hole in what ever it hit.
I would call it an Arty Round, it would be a moving mine that would move
across the board, if any thing was under the impact point would get fired at
by a mine, maybe roll to hit on a D8, just a thought, then
there are the automated missile firing mines, a GSM/L that fires once at
the first target that gets with in a sertine distance?
-Stephen