> Tony sagely wrote:
I would add the following clarifications:
- Both units perform a fire action
immediately.
- The leapfrogging unit fires with half its
firepower (since the unit is split between moving and covering
troops - this also has implications for play
balance)
- Casualties/Suppressions are determined
after both units have fired.
Tomb: I like this a lot. I'll try it out and let you know how it pans out.
Seems reasonable to me.
PS - For someone who asked: At the time I
trained, which is many years ago now (gawd, two decades...), we used to use a
mnemonic to help us get bounding "right" -
you stayed up (the length of your bound) a time (not distance, that depends
how fast you are!) enough to say (all as one
runtogetherphrase) "up-he-sees-me-
down". So typical bounds were only a few meters at a time.
I have heard it said that the Paras tried this in the Falklands, and
subsequent review found this pace of advance to slow (the cover benefits were
offset by the length of
time you spent under enemy guns) - the
get up and run at them (close assault) was felt to be more useful in some
situations (even though it exposes you to more immediate risk, the cumulative
risk ends up
being less - or something). Also note that
the bounding A2C I learned was quite tiring... you spent a lot of time heaving
yourself up, making a few paces of sprint, then catapulting yourself prone
again to draw a bead and start shooting. You have to be in very good shape to
not have this
tire/wind you shortly.
Maybe someone else who has trained in
advance-to-contact procedure of a more
recent vintage might have a comment on current doctrine?
> Tony sagely wrote:
Alternately, you could roll off and see who fires first--depends on your
house rules for OW, but I'd suggest something like "if X>2Y, X fires first"
or "if X-Y>2, X fires first". I thought about "always simultaneous",
but what happens if a Green unit is advancing and a Red squad ambushes them?
Wouldn't the Reds have at least a chance to fire first?
> - The leapfrogging unit fires with half its
That's what I was going to suggest initially but I figured the moving team
is only going to be moving for 3-5 seconds at a time anyway, and the
turn is several minutes long. Perhaps play balance would be adequately
addressed by: a. these guys are only making one movement instead of two b.
they can't fire on just anyone, has to be previously unknown or a unit who
fires on them c. both sides can use this
On Wed, 6 Nov 2002 04:28:33 -0500, "Thomas Barclay" <kaladorn@magma.ca>
wrote:
> I have heard it said that the Paras tried this
Then it sounds as though the rules already handle this, as I already
mentioned. It's covered in the ability to move and fire in the same turn with
two different actions. The problem is that you are moving a full 6" move. You
could just move the moving unit 2" and stop. With this, the moving unit
doesn't get that far away from the firing unit.
This will result in the bounding group being slower to move than a
non-bounding opponent. This would represent fatigue and the slower
bounding system. The house rule you suggested wouldn't have this effect.
Try just moving small amounts instead of moving the full 6" of available
movement. Tie this in to "stealth movement" to make the bounding unit harder
to see.
As for modern training, TLC has been running programmes showing modern US
training (Marines and Army mostly). They showed soldiers being trained in
exactly what you described, down to them yelling (and later, as they got more
tired, muttering under their breath) essentially the same mneumonic.
From: Allan Goodall agoodall@hyperbear.com
> This will result in the bounding group being slower to move than a
Except the house rule I suggested would have the units making a single combat
move each turn, instead of two normal moves.
On 6-Nov-02 at 09:52, laserlight@quixnet.net (laserlight@quixnet.net)
wrote:
> From: Allan Goodall agoodall@hyperbear.com
So simultaneous fire or roll QD for first fire?
> Except the house rule I suggested would have the units making a single
RBW:
> So simultaneous fire or roll QD for first fire?
Or roll QD for first fire. Side 1 performs its fire. Side 2 suffers any
casualties and then returns fire. *Then* apply any suppressions. That way side
2 doesn't lose its fire.