Real Real Real Thrust (Was: Re: Lunar combat )

> Mikko Kurki-Suonio <maxxon@swob.dna.fi> wrote:

> > A proper-physics lunar combat game could be fun.... :)

> Perhaps, but my experience suggests that finding players for

Calculus? As in differentiation and integration?
I don't see that an inability to calculate your ship's co-ordinates to a
few decimal places is going to be a problem - so long as you've got a
rough feel for the way things move, you should be ok.

> Hmmm... maybe I should write proper-physics vector movement system for

Hmm, well you can ditch instant acceleration quite easily:

     [assuming you've got a marker next to the base of the ship,
showing its direction of motion, and that you have its speed written down]

1) Move the ship by its current speed. Leaving the marker at the ship's old
position.

2) Move the ship in the direction of any thrust applied, but only move it by
half the value of the thrust.

3) Move the marker by half the value of the thrust in the opposite direction
to the applied thrust.

4) Measure the distance between the marker and the ship. Record this as the
ship's new speed.

5) Move the marker in a straight line towards the ship, until it touches
     the base of the ship - this gives you the ship's direction of
motion for next turn.

I think this is almost identical to the current real thrust system, but the
thrust will be applied through the whole of a turn, and not instantly at the
start of a turn.

This doesn't cater for rotating and thrusting during the same turn, unless you
allow rotation to be instantaneous.

(I'll have a think about continuous rotation and thrust at the same time)

I'm not sure what you mean by ditching discrete time - do you mean
abandoning the structure of fixed length synchronous turns? This would allow
ships to perform actions of varying lengths, but might be awkward to play.
Could be interesting though.

Hmm...

> On Fri, 8 May 1998 alun.thomas@cbis.com wrote:

> This doesn't cater for rotating and thrusting during the same turn,

Exactly... that's when the fun really starts...

> unless

I thought we were talking about real physics. Rotation is not instantaneous,
and neither is angular acceleration.

In any case, as I've told before, I tried something essentially your
simplified "real" thrust for campaign movement last year. With only vector
addition and "s=0.5*at^2" to worry about, guess how many players used the
system (to reach relatively FIXED points like planets)?

None. Zero. Nobody. Not a living soul. They simply refused to.

Until I wrote a program to handle the math.

If it had been my kid sister, I wouldn't have wondered, but 75% of the players
were technology students, supposed to be able to handle far harder stuff for a
living...

> I'm not sure what you mean by ditching discrete time - do you mean

Yes. Though it doesn't add much from the physics standpoint.