Groan... the recent posts regarding Starship are exactly what I hoped wouldn't
happen. I must apologize to the list for inadvertently starting this thread.
It was I who forwarded the lister comments regarding Starship to a Flagship
representative, who I must say wasn't Brad. I did this only to provide
information on how the game had recently been received, with the hopes that it
would improve their future presentation of the system. I didn't expect Brad to
begin a series of posts to the GZG Mailing list attempting to prove the
superiority of Starship to Full Thrust.
Brad - you ought to understand the GZG Mailing List is a community
dedicated, if not fanatical, to the GZG systems and Full Thrust in particular.
Your posts and continued posting on this topic, Starship, equates to 19th
century missionaries blunderings in Asia. There are far better forums for such
information on Starship, the Starship Combat News Group in particular.
Oerjann - you must be commended on stepping to the front to carry the
GZG banner, you do it so well.;) I hope that you'll let this fade away.
To the rest of the list - again you have my most sincere apologies for
the obvious breach of net etiquette. I hope you understand that this diatribe
wasn't my intention, but much more my horror.
From: <Aron_Clark@digidesign.com>
> Groan . . . the recent posts regarding Starship are exactly
It hasn't been all that disastrous. Starship! probably IS
superior to FT is some respect--if I was interested in a "there's
a different race on every planet" type of universe, for example, then it
sounds as if it has some good ideas. And I didn't think Brad was "defending"
so much as "explaining." It's hard to tell
someone's tone of voice over e-mail.
Brad, FYI in case you didn't know, Oerjan is one of our resident analysts, a
top playtester for FT Fleet Book 2 (among others) and contributed in some
unspecified (or perhaps "specified but not in the last week and my memory is
struggling") but major way to Starfire's design. So he has some experience in
the field.
All hands--when there's a new person on the list (and I can think
of other recent examples besides Brad) perhaps it would be as well to give a
little introduction as to our expertise? Some of
us are math-challenged, absent-minded, introverted teenagers
(that's me--and has been for 25 years), but some of us have a
little more impressive credentials.
> Aron_Clark@digidesign.com wrote:
> Groan . . . the recent posts regarding Starship are exactly what I
First of all, Aron, if it makes you feel better, If you hadn't, someone else
would have, as I received other emails on the same day, also concerning
Starship vs. FT, and this list.
Second, I, as stated previously, had no intention of "promoting" Starship
within what, I knew full well, might be a somewhat hostile venue. I only
posted in order to correct statements made by others in this forum that I felt
were inaccurate. Since, in at least one case, my integrity was being
questioned, I feel I had a right to do so.
Since this IS a public forum, I assumed such comments from me would not be
inappropriate or unwelcome. I have tried to make all of my comments pertanent,
and not expand the scope into shameless marketing of other aspects of Starship
or other FSG products. Discussing the relative merits of FT vs other games,
however, especially in providing information about a new game seems to me to
be very much
on-topic.
Third, I don't feel that Starship is superior, overall, to FT. I DO believe it
is superior in certain areas, and that FT is superior in other areas.
> Brad - you ought to understand the GZG Mailing List is a community
I am, and as stated above, have been, fully aware of that.
If members of this list had not initiated a Starship-related topic, I
would never have posted here.
> Your posts and
I have corrected errors, given examples, and answered questions.
I have not (and certainly could have) posted long and numerous messages about
the wonders of our campaign system, or our cool models, or the near mystical
experience of owning our Battlepoles.
I have avoided, as much as possible, evangelizing. I have acknowledged FT's
many strengths.
I find your comment unsubstantiated, immature, and offensive.
And since I have been playing starship-combat games for at least the
last 20 years, FT among them, I would think I have as much right to belong to
this list as you.
I don't mean to sound unduly harsh, but you do give cause, Sir.
> There are far better forums for such information on
I agree, I have been sending information to that site for some time, while
avoiding groups such as this.
> Oerjann - you must be commended on stepping to the front to carry the
My understanding is that he had questions and that I was answering them.
Others on this list who are interested have the ability to join in, or avoid
the topic altogether.
I don't see how this concerns you at all.
> To the rest of the list - again you have my most sincere apologies for
Please explain the breach I have commited in contributing to a civil,
on-topic
discussion.
> I hope you understand that this diatribe
Shame may be appropriate. This... tantrum... seems beneath you.
If my posts to this list are, in fact, unwelcome, I will gladly withdraw and
take any further questions privately. I can always be reached via the FSG
website:
http://www.flagshipgames.com/
On the other hand, if others on this list are interested in continuing or
initiating appropriate topics, I will endeavor to respond without missionary
zeal.
Sincerely,
> Laserlight wrote:
> From: <Aron_Clark@digidesign.com>
Thanks for your confidence. My intent has been to be open and friendly in my
posts.
It is, I admit, easy for these sorts of discussions to escalate unreasonably.
> Brad, FYI in case you didn't know, Oerjan is one of our resident
Cool! In that case I shall go back and re-read his comments with greater
care.
> All hands--when there's a new person on the list (and I can think
> Laserlight wrote:
OK, here's mine:
Playtester for FB1 and FB2. Like every other playtester, was involved in
making a small subset of the rules, which Jon Tuffley then refined, winnowed
out, greatly expanded and published (ie we do a few concepts, he does the real
work...)
Professionally, I've been Chief Architect for some state-of-the-art
Naval Combat
Systems, TEWA (Threat Evaluation and Weapon Assignment), GA-AI ( Genetic
Algorithm generation of Artificial Intelligence) systems for missile defence,
and so on. Unless a real mathematician is present, I'll usually do for
exterior ballistics, finite element modelling, monte carlo analysis etc.
My interest in game mechanics is trying to get the best simulation (or at
least "plausible model") with the simplest method. For example, the Planetary
Invasion system in "Imperium" is a minor classic, it give the "feel" of drop
troops and strategic combat with a minimum of effort. So it's DBA and DBM for
me rather
My Credentials:
FT: NONE 8^)
Stargrunt - None on this game but I have been playing with board
wargames since 1959, Toy Soldiers (plastic $1 bags, then model kits) since
whenever, military miniatures per se since the end of the 1960's
(seriously since about 1971/1973,) and computer wargames since 'cassette
tape' computers were the norm (year?) but now I stick almost completely to
miniatures.
Dirtside 2 - almost memorized the rules, collecting 1/300th-1/285th-6 mm
figures for the game and serious lurker on several lists where it is (at least
as much as I can make it) discussed.
Other Science Fiction - Starguard since a friend had Edition 1 - I own
edition 5, over 30 years this game has kept going. I love it for SF
skirmishes. I was looking for something for more 'battle' and less 'skirmish'
oriented which led me to DS 2.
Historical/Fantasy - not relevant directly but I started with
Historicals (ACW board game in, IIRC, 1959) and went to Fantasy with the
publishing of Tolkien's trilogy in the USA. SF was the last of the three. I
have still the original white box set for D&D, even though the wife and I no
longer play FRPG's.
Generally - I am a Regional Analyst for National Imagery and Mapping
Agency which is a member of the USA INTEL community (came out of Cartographer
in DMA, a DOD support agency until it was absorbed by the INTEL community.)
The above and a dollar will get you cup of coffee... <grin>