Short Answer: very small units.
Long Answer: Due to the way point fire weapons work in SG, each unit could, at
most, fire two point fire weapons at a vehicle. (I run
missile teams of two GMS/L + loaders for this reason).
As a house rule for the setting, you could allow squads to fire as small arms
fire, but let the weapons retain their Point Fire ability. This
would give you Suppression/Minor Hit capabilities, but would preclude
scoring a Major Hit unless you have one of the troops take careful aim
and fire using the normal point-fire rules.
Brendan 'Neath Southern Skies
http://home.pacific.net.au/~southernsk/
________________________________
From: On Behalf Of emu2020
Sent: Monday, May 14, 2007 9:20 AM
Subject: [GZG] How to handle units armed with "heavy" weapons
Doing an SG2 game in a heavily themed environment, similar in
nature to the SF3D/MaK setting where armored units are the norm and even
your average infantryman carries a weapon that will give him some level of
firepower against a power suit or some such.
I am curious how people are handling settings like this where even common
troopers carry "heavy" weapons? I know it has been asked before, so even a
link to data on this would be useful.
Thanks,
-Eli
_______________________________________________
Gzg-l mailing list
Gzg-l@lists.csua.berkeley.edu
http://lists.csua.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gzg-lThe premise of the
military I am designing is a man versus machine sort of force where the
concept is to even the playing field by using relatively low-tech forces
with lots of manpower, good weapons and lots of them. They don't have a lot of
heavy vehicles and many of the vehicles they do have are built from either
lighter vehicles which have been upgunned or converted from civilian vehicles
(a little more than technicals but not quite).
Their main infantry force is armed with HAMR style weapons firing lots
of armor-piercing rounds as well as short to medium range ATGMs and
rockets. I am still in the infant stages of this planning and as such haven't
settled onto troop numbers. Wanted to get the rules and the TO&E out of the
way before purchasing any major quanitites.
Any siggestions would be welcomed.
-Eli
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "Robertson, Brendan" <Brendan.Robertson@dva.gov.au>
> Short Answer: very small units.
> and fire using the normal point-fire rules.
> IMPORTANT
> On 5/13/07, emu2020@comcast.net <emu2020@comcast.net> wrote:
They
> don't have a lot of heavy vehicles and many of the vehicles they do
The infantry force would be eaten for lunch by other infantry. There is a
reason that most infantry forces have a mix of different weapons.
Using SGII rules, without houseruling things extensively, your best
bet would be to organize in small teams, 2-3 men each, each built
around a single heavy weapon with one or two ammo bearers/riflemen.
And then the first time that force runs into some light infantry, they will
start reconsidering having regular rifle squads in the force mix.
_______________________________________________
Gzg-l mailing list
Gzg-l@lists.csua.berkeley.edu
http://lists.csua.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gzg-lDuely noted.
I just like the big gun look and wanted to have a PSB explination. I am
modelling the infantry after those portayed in the artwork by Kow Yokohama and
another designer named Kondo. They have this whole retro
hi-tech thing going on. Anyone else have a better PSB suggestions for a
bunch of guys packing around big guns? Due keep in mind that the force is the
type of force that would be hired to even the odds for local
colonial forces who mightn ot have anti-armor capacity.
-Eli
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "John Atkinson" <johnmatkinson@gmail.com>
> On 5/13/07, emu2020@comcast.net wrote:
> Using SGII rules, without houseruling things extensively, your best
> will start reconsidering having regular rifle squads in the force mix.
> John
_______________________________________________
Gzg-l mailing list
Gzg-l@lists.csua.berkeley.edu
http://lists.csua.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gzg-lHow do you handle
militaries like Hammer's Slammers or some of the units from the Traveller
universe? Sorry, not too experienced at designing unconventional forces and
need all the help I can get.
-Eli
The infantry force would be eaten for lunch by other infantry. There
is a reason that most infantry forces have a mix of different weapons.
Using SGII rules, without houseruling things extensively, your best
bet would be to organize in small teams, 2-3 men each, each built
around a single heavy weapon with one or two ammo bearers/riflemen.
And then the first time that force runs into some light infantry, they
will start reconsidering having regular rifle squads in the force mix.
John
_______________________________________________
Gzg-l mailing list
Gzg-l@lists.csua.berkeley.edu
http://lists.csua.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gzg-lHi
Doesn't your force organization depend on the background of your "universe"
and the forces that exist within it?
Unless you are designing a force that you are planning to take to tournaments
where you will meet players from different gaming groups you can design what
you want.
If your background has all the formations as heavily armored because the
warfare is very fluid or the environments are hazardous to troops exposed for
extended periods then heavily anti armor forces make sense, to a point.
Hammers Slammers and the like exist because the background wants them to work
that way. If you create LOS range energy weapons that work better on tanks
than on airframes then tanks and GEVs rule.
However even a tank force will need supporting infantry to hold it.
If the opposite to a tank is an infantryman with an anti tank weapon then you
will need scouts to locate and drive off the ATGW teams. They in turn need
anti infantry defense to fight off enemy infantry. Assuming you don't simply
call in an artillery strike and cluster bomb the whole area. It's the only way
to be sure...
Within a gaming group it can be fun to develop an arms race as one player
develops tactics to counter another. can also be expensive to keep buying more
models though.
I'd look at 20th century platoon organisations as a good basis of how to
arrange a force.
> On 5/14/07, Eli Arndt <emu2020@comcast.net> wrote:
Generally, I don't.
But Hammer's Slammers can adequately simulated by having high-impact,
low FP (FP 1, Imp d12) rifles and IAVRs in the infantry squads. All
other weapons in that universe are vehicle-mounted.
As for Traveller, there was a scenario floating around that was based on
Traveller and had everyone armed with plasma guns. IIRC, the units were
smaller.
_______________________________________________
Gzg-l mailing list
Gzg-l@lists.csua.berkeley.edu
http://lists.csua.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gzg-lPerhaps I am going
about this the wrong way. I think I have been trying to make the force's image
style disctate tactics instead of just letting it be a style. Who is to say my
force doesn't use a longer rifle, perhaps a
long-barreled gauss weapon which I can model from the numerous WW2 LMG
troopers.
Stat-wise they could just be normal Gauss Weapons, allowing the force to
be competitive with various forces while still having the "look" I want.
Thanks for helpingm e get my head around this.
-Eli
-------------- Original message --------------
From: "John Atkinson" <johnmatkinson@gmail.com>
> On 5/14/07, Eli Arndt wrote:
> > unconventional forces and need all the help I can get.
> On 5/15/07, emu2020@comcast.net <emu2020@comcast.net> wrote:
Just off the top of my head, presuming you want to have a look that involves
most of your weapons being larger than average and also some sort of game
mechanic difference that means your force "feels" different than your average
force...
If you wanted, and your opponent agreed, you could have them be gauss weapons
with adjustable settings. It could have a 'low power' setting with FP 2 Imp
d12 as a rifle, or could be dialed up to produce a light
anti-armor effect as per a HAMR. Then you put some sort of limit on
it--perhaps HAMR setting requires an auxilliary battery pack and each
trooper is only issued two auxilliary battery packs. It would be more
paperwork, or you could use counters or something. Game balance-wise,
it wouldn't be any worse than issuing a lot of IAVRs, especially if you
limited the HAMR to targeting individual models as it is a point weapon rather
than an explosive warhead.
Or you could say that your forces use a modular weapon system with only minor
differences between AR, LMG, and Sniper systems. You just have to do a little
modding to represent the differences well enough that you can tell yourself.
_______________________________________________
Gzg-l mailing list
Gzg-l@lists.csua.berkeley.edu
http://lists.csua.berkeley.edu/mailman/listinfo/gzg-lFunny you should
mention it John, I was planning on using a little of both ideas. In purchasing
the MG troopers, many of the poses are not suitable for a single man operating
the weapon. Those laying down with ammo handlers will likely get converted to
battery packs and scoped weapons.
-Eli
Just off the top of my head, presuming you want to have a look that
involves most of your weapons being larger than average and also some
sort of game mechanic difference that means your force "feels"
different than your average force...
If you wanted, and your opponent agreed, you could have them be gauss
weapons with adjustable settings. It could have a 'low power' setting
with FP 2 Imp d12 as a rifle, or could be dialed up to produce a light
anti-armor effect as per a HAMR. Then you put some sort of limit on
it--perhaps HAMR setting requires an auxilliary battery pack and each
trooper is only issued two auxilliary battery packs. It would be more
paperwork, or you could use counters or something. Game balance-wise,
it wouldn't be any worse than issuing a lot of IAVRs, especially if
you limited the HAMR to targeting individual models as it is a point
weapon rather than an explosive warhead.
Or you could say that your forces use a modular weapon system with
only minor differences between AR, LMG, and Sniper systems. You just
have to do a little modding to represent the differences well enough
that you can tell yourself.
John