I definitely like this. Good rationale for low start speeds across a
face-to-face table.
Perhaps a start of game initiative phase to determine setup: 1) Roll dice,
reroll ties, loser choses "deployment point" somewhere on the table. Winner
chooses second. 2) Roll dice again, winner chooses whether their force is
"arriving" or "in place". Loser is the opposite. In case of ties, both sides
are "arriving". 3) Roll dice, reroll ties for determinig ship placement.
Players alternate placing ships on the board. Ships "in place" stay where
they're put. "Arriving" ships have some misjump possibility - half or
less than that of standard FTL arrival. Ships that arrive but are displaced
off the board are out of play.
Start speed for the game is up to 1xMD for any given ship.
Noam:
> Perhaps a start of game initiative phase to determine setup:
1. Divide your forces up into "Jumped on Turn 0" and "Prepping for jump" 2.
Roll initiative. Losers put their "Jumped" force on the table, including
arrival deviation. Winners then put their force on the table, including
arrival deviation. Losers get a turn or two of acceleration.
Idealy you'd have your offtable forces set up too, since someone could jump in
and engage them, but ideally you'd want to attack someone who has already
jumped, since tehy won't be able to jump away from you for a few turns.
Need some mechanism for "are you ready to jump yet?" with penalties for high
mass and speed.
[quoted original message omitted]
> From: john tailby
I'm thinking that Blue jumps to point A; Red detects them and jumps in
afterward.
> Also the turn sequence allows you to make emergency jumps into
Current background says you can't jump more than once in six hours, and
it doesn't say how far thath jump is. If you can jump a few light-hours
away. then you can easily disengage from combat, as Red won't have time to
detect you before you can make another jump.
I don't like the "one turn warm up"; I'd like it to be several turns.
> If you did have both sides jumping into the table then how would you
Sure would discourage the Fist of Doom, wouldn't it?
> If you did allow tactical jumps the attacker might drop out right on
I'm thinking of tact jumps being a few light seconds, at most; sounds
like you're thinking of light-hours.
> Also doesn't assault jumping put ordinance fleets at a disadvantage to
It would be prudent to jump in a little farther away than the enemy can
shoot--which is the way most FT battles are set up.
> I'm thinking that Blue jumps to point A; Red detects them and jumps in
> afterward.
> direct fire fleets? You enter on the table during the movement phase
I've sniped a bit of the discussion.
Doesn't this argument actually describe why it makes good fleet tactical
sense to deploy like it is done in the games?
If you can only jump once every 6 hours while the FTL recharges then if you do
a tactical jump you can't jump out if things go wrong. So if you are going to
jump in you better be really sure that you are going to win.
Same thing goes for why don't you rush towards the enemy with a big initial
velocity? If you are doing speed 20+ towards the enemy then a turn when
you try and jump out puts them on top of you before you can jump. At point
blank range when you can't even shoot back it will be very bad. Also there
would be a good chance of there being an enemy ship within 6mu of your jump
point and so making you escape very dangerous.
If you go in at a low velocity and don't like the look of the enemy fleet you
can disperse and jump before the enemy fleet can get to close range.
Also tactical jumps sound a lot like parachute drops to me. If you try and
group your ships when they emerge when they scatter all over the place they
end up on top of each other and damage each other. If you jump in with a big
dispersal to avoid the scatter then you risk getting picked off my a mutually
supporting fleet.
If you don't use the tactical jump to get onto the table then you have a
normal deployment and all you have done is deny your ships the option of
escaping because you are entering battle with your FTL drained.
I've done hyper assaults in our latest campaign but usually when I only have
one big ship and its an easy way to get closer to the enemy without worrying
about any long range closing fire.
I have also done it when trying to pin down an enemy ship before it can flee.
JohnT said:
> Doesn't this argument actually describe why it makes good fleet
If you meant "tacjump would result in engagements which occur in the same way
the FT games are actually set up", then my answer is "that's the reason for
discussing tacjump." I'm not certain that's what you meant.
> If you can only jump once every 6 hours while the FTL recharges then
Right. How often, when setting up an even-points battle, are you sure
before the battle starts that you will win? And if you're on the short end of
a
battle with uneven points, why would you stick around? You'd wantt to jump in
on a smaller enemy, and he'd then want to jump out as fast as
possible--which currently is one turn.
> Same thing goes for why don't you rush towards the enemy with a big
Not necessarily. You could zoom in, shoot, and then jump out when you've
gone past.
> Also there would be a good chance of there being an enemy ship within
If there's one thing that needs to be changed about FTL, it's the "damage from
jumping out"
> If you go in at a low velocity and don't like the look of the enemy
Not if you can only jump every six hours.
> Also tactical jumps sound a lot like parachute drops to me.
Imagine two opposing paradrops into the same area.
[quoted original message omitted]
> If you can only jump once every 6 hours while the FTL recharges
Recharging for a tacjump wouldn't take six hours. I'm pretty sure that my
first post said "half a dozen turns" or something to that effect. Does that
make it look better?
> Why does this mechanic need changing? If you make it too easy for a
So? They can do that anyway.
> Imagine two opposing paradrops into the same area.
Not necessarily random, just dispersed.
> There is a reason that paradroping is not used into a warzone often.
It's high risk and the casualties are often heavy.
Don't carry the paradrop analogy too far. In this case *both sides* are
dropping in.
[quoted original message omitted]
> Unless you are changing the FTL entry mechanic,
YES, that's what I'm proposing!
> Unless you are changing the FTL entry mechanic
To summarize:
--Tacjumps do not take 6 hours to cycle. They should take a few turns,
so as to be long enough that an outmatched opponent can't just immediately
jump away (otherwise you'd never fight a battle), but short enough to make it
worthwhile to commit to a jump (ie you won't be trapped for six hours while
your drive cycles).
--Tacjumps cover fairly short distances--lightminutes, not lightyears.
--No damage from jumping out
--Damage from jumping in only if you overlap another ship--no definition
of "overlap" yet
--Some scattering on arrival, enough to discourage "everyone arrives 3mu
away from each other" but not all over the board