> Noah Doyle <nvdoyle@midlink.com> wrote:
<SNIP!>
> A few notes are necessary here. Standard GMS's are only good against
I allow that VTOLs are valid targets in high mode and in range, because they
can fire at ground targets in range.
> To shoot at aircraft/VTOLs in High,
My variant is based on the capacity requirements of twin weapons in a turret,
which is what the DSII ADS seems to be based on.
> As there were only 2 sizes, I
German Gepard. Twin 30/35 mm cannon AA defence vehicle. Leopard
chassis is about size 4, in my opinion.
> It's a personal
I agree! One could even go to the extent of placing ADS on aircraft!
> The whole thing is designed to give the ability to create a really
Though you could have slow flying aerospace craft and ground attack aerospace
craft variants using terrain to hide behind! See my DSII site for more.
<SNIP!>
> *If a VTOL/aerospace craft suffers a target systems down check, you
I think you're wrong here. A Target Systems Down and Firer Systems Down chit
result just means the vehicle with the chit can't perform any combat actions,
until the crew fix the problem or a Engineer vehicle can fix it.
While a VTOL/Aerospace Craft is unlikely to have Engineer
VTOLs/Aerospace
Craft, the crew can still push reset buttons, invert the aerospace craft or
shake the VTOL to free jammed weaponry, remove the safety catch from the
weapon's release button, or realise they've pushed the wrong button! Just let
the crew of that craft perform a repair check instead of a combat action as
per the standard rules. Assume aerospace craft are flying over their own lines
while doing this. VTOLs should move to cover, then try to fix the problem.
> ... Mobility hit? Crash.
I would let the VTOL/Aerospace craft land immobilised at the point
of
weapons impact. If the VTOL/Aerospace craft came from a humane (caring)
force, they will have to rescue the crew. Or you could capture the crew, and
interrogate them! While you're trying to do that, the crew can frantically try
to restart engines, etc. and fly away, or maybe they decide to leap out and
hoof it back to their own lines? Just use the standard rules for immobilized
vehicles in DSII. This avoids having to remember too much!
Andrew Martin responds
> Noah Doyle <nvdoyle@midlink.com> wrote:
<SNIP!>
> A few notes are necessary here. Standard GMS's are only good against
I allow that VTOLs are valid targets in high mode and in range, because they
can fire at ground targets in range.
XXX Well, that's not a bad idea - I'm concerned about the feasability of
it, but that's a personal vision bit. I think that letting standard GMS's
target both ground & air vehicles (except Low VTOLS) makes them a little
too powerful, XXX
> To shoot at aircraft/VTOLs in High,
My variant is based on the capacity requirements of twin weapons in a turret,
which is what the DSII ADS seems to be based on.
XXX Hmmmm. Hadn't thought of that - the size comes out right. But I
see a
lot of single-weapon ADS systems in real life - then again, it may not
mean anything. I was thinking that it was 1 weapon attached to a really big
fire control system (radar, ladar, whatever). XXX
> As there were only 2 sizes, I
had
> a hard time seeing a class 4 vehicle chock-full-o-ADS.
German Gepard. Twin 30/35 mm cannon AA defence vehicle. Leopard
chassis is about size 4, in my opinion.
XXX This one is really a judgement call. I rate modern MBTs at Size 3 -
usually with a size 3 gun. But I've got a lot of vehicle models to cover & I
want them all on the same relative scale. The Flakpanzer Gepard (what's
'Gepard' translate as, anyway?), I rate at size 3 - only a Heavy ADS
system. I was abstracting the multiple barrels, I guess. This may require
more thought. The Gepard is possibly the coolest-looking AAA unit
today.
XXX
> It's a personal
I agree! One could even go to the extent of placing ADS on aircraft!
XXX Yuck. All the better to shoot you down with, my dear. XXX
> The whole thing is designed to give the ability to create a really
Though you could have slow flying aerospace craft and ground attack aerospace
craft variants using terrain to hide behind! See my DSII site for more.
XXX I was thinking about having a Low mode for aerospacecraft, but it would
come with some penalties. XXX
<SNIP!>
> *If a VTOL/aerospace craft suffers a target systems down check, you
I think you're wrong here. A Target Systems Down and Firer Systems Down chit
result just means the vehicle with the chit can't perform any combat actions,
until the crew fix the problem or a Engineer vehicle can fix it.
While a VTOL/Aerospace Craft is unlikely to have Engineer
VTOLs/Aerospace
Craft, the crew can still push reset buttons, invert the aerospace craft or
shake the VTOL to free jammed weaponry, remove the safety catch from the
weapon's release button, or realise they've pushed the wrong button! Just let
the crew of that craft perform a repair check instead of a combat action as
per the standard rules. Assume aerospace craft are flying over their own lines
while doing this. VTOLs should move to cover, then try to fix the problem.
XXX See, kids, this is what happens when you post at 0-bloody-100 hours.
They can still move, you're right. For Aerospacecraft, it would definately be
an abort. XXX
> ... Mobility hit? Crash.
I would let the VTOL/Aerospace craft land immobilised at the point
of
weapons impact. If the VTOL/Aerospace craft came from a humane (caring)
force, they will have to rescue the crew. Or you could capture the crew,
and interrogate them! While you're trying to do that, the crew can frantically
try to restart engines, etc. and fly away, or maybe they decide to leap out
and hoof it back to their own lines? Just use the standard rules for
immobilized vehicles in DSII. This avoids having to remember too much!
XXX VTOL - I'd make a guality check versus a pretty high number - 5 or
6.
If they make it, they land OK. Aerospcecraft - unless there is a strip
on the board, it's a crater. Bailed pilots, OTOH, might be a good reason for a
Search And Rescue mission. Throw out a counter to represent the
pilot(s), and a few dummies - neither side knows which is which, and
have at it. XXX
> Noah Doyle <nvdoyle@midlink.com> wrote:
VTOLs in my game stick close to the ground which is very similar to real life.
They don't sit high up in the air taking pot shots as they fancy with no fear.
Personal vision yes, but I also end up with a fairer game, I feel.
======
> My variant is based on the capacity requirements of twin weapons in
Say, only RED chits valid instead of ALL chits valid. Or, say, four weapons in
a turret, either two attempts at one target or multiply points cost by 5
instead of 10. In all cases, range as per individual weapon.
======
> As there were only 2 sizes, I
My rough conversion guide for modern vehicles is:
Large car: Size 1 Eagle, HumVee, Ferret.
10-20 tons: Size 2 M113, Piranha.
20-30 tons: Size 3 Bradley, Warrior.
30-40 tons: Size 4 Leopard 1, M60, 1960s-1970s MBT.
40-50+ tons: Size 5 M1, Le Clerc, Arriette, Modern MBT.
50-60 tons: Size 6
20-25mm AC: RFAC/1
30-35mm AC: RFAC/2
90mm cannon: HVC/3
105mm cannon: HVC/4
120mm cannon: HVC/5
5.56mm APSW: LAPSW
7.62mm APSW: APSW
0.50 cal MG: HAPSW
======
> XXX I was thinking about having a Low mode for aerospacecraft, but it
http://members.xoom.com/AndrewMartin/DSII/
in the aerospace house rules section.
======
> XXX VTOL - I'd make a guality check versus a pretty high number - 5 or
But, ejected pilots from destroyed planes is a neat idea! I'll use it in my
"SCUD Hunters" scenario!