GW

Hi everybody, I am new to the list and just started to play FT.

I wonder if anybody has thought about using FT as Space combat interface

for Epic 40000 of GW. As I play this game too.

If so any ideas for Ships designs for Imperium IG SM or Orcs????

cheers Tom

Hey Tom

Check out the new issue of white dwarf in there you will find a space game set
in the 40k universe. surpassingly it looks a lot like Full Thrust. HMMMM where
do you think they are getting their ideas from? Just proves that GW is loseing
all ability to think and create themselves.

Rick

> -----Original Message-----

> RICK L MOWER wrote:

> Check out the new issue of white dwarf in there you will find a space
HMMMM
> where do you think they are getting their ideas from?

And no doubt they'll change "railgun" to "railgunz" and trademark the whole
thing.

Tom,

Los

> Rick

Aaron Teske does a space fleet conversion but my link is broken. Does anyone
have teh new one for Tom?

Los

> Thomas Riepe wrote:

> Hi everybody,

> RICK L MOWER wrote:
HMMMM
> where do you think they are getting their ideas from?

Haven't seen that one, so no comment, but I got the Battlerage game out of
curiosity.

It's an overpriced, underproduced small press game. The authors either don't
know what a copy editor is, didn't think they'd need one or couldn't afford
one. They also need a professional artist and a laser printer.

It's no serious simulation, but it could be a fun little game. One of
those learn-in-five-minutes, easily suitable for conventions, store
demos etc. The "use your figures and background" attitude is not shockingly
new anymore, but always welcome.

But I honestly can't see this as a direct rip-off of FMA.

Initiative. Errr... absolutely vanilla stuff with warts and all, nevermind
that it's the natural step from Igo-Ugo.

Even though statistics are presented as different dice types, modifiers
are straight additions/subtractions instead of FMA-style dice shifts or
secondary dice. The "natural one" rule doesn't have a direct counterpart in
FMA either. The game is just so simple that I think it's pointless to gloat
over minute details.

E.g. pick any two old school board wargames. Odds are, they have
Igo-Ugo initiative, use hexes and movement points to regulate movement,
single number for combat strength and use a 2d6 CRT. Are they all just
carbon copies ready-for-litigation?

I don't think so. It's the more complex rules that set them apart.

> Just proves that GW is loseing all ability to think and create

Nah. GW is in the market for games with *very* simple basic rules (and
afterwards cluttered with simple, but very numerous, special rules). There
are only so many ways you can use a six-sider.

Let's see. Basic game mechanics.

Initiative: Roughly speaking, it's either the old Igo-Ugo, pre-ordained
value based (values either set in stone or fluctuating from turn to turn) or
alternating. Three basic choices.

Action resolution: Either an "action point" system, or everyone has the same
choices what to do. Two basic choices.

Dice resolution: Either you roll a dice type determined by the action, or
one determined by equipment/statistic. You either roll against a set
number or against another roll by an opponent. Two and two basic choices.

Modifiers: Either you get set bonuses to rolls, or "column shifts" (dice type
shifts fall into this category). Two basic choices. Three if you count using
both.

Result resolution: Either chart-based, or based on calculation from dice
rolls (chit/card pull is just another way to roll dice). By necessity,
this calculation is very simple (set number, higher, double etc.). Two basic
choices.

3 * 2 * 2 * 2 * 3 * 2 = 72 variations. Now, how many games are there?

Obviously, I've probably omitted a few choices, but hopefully this serves as
an example how finite the number of ways to combine fundamental basic
mechanics really is. Especially when you're trying to model basically the same
thing. Or trying to use meaningful combinations only.

> Thomas Riepe wrote:

> Hi everybody,

Not for Orcs, no. The stats for Imperial and Eldar ships in GW's old space
combat game Space Fleet are available on Aaron Teske's web site at

http://www.hicom.net/~teske/sfleet.html

A simple conversion of the SF stats to FT is:

Soace Fleet "Speed" = Full Thrust "Thrust rating". All Imperial ships have FTL
drives; it can be argued that Eldar ships shouldn't.

Space Fleet range "3" = Full Thrust range "12" (ie, one range band). 1 Space
Fleet firepower = 1 Full Thrust beam die in the nearest range band. Use these
two guidelines to determine the beam armaments of the various ships.

The special weapons used in Space Fleet translate roughly as...

Vortex Torpedo = FT Pulse Torpedo Inferno Cannon = FT Nova Cannon (or Wavegun,
if you feel cautious)
Fusion Cannon - tricky. I tend to use massed Pulse Torps, but they're
not that accurate.
Plasma Torpedo (Eldar weapon) = a battery of 2-3 Needle Beams

Determine the weapons you want a ship to have; that gives you the Mass (and
damage capacity) of the ship.

I've seen designs like these on a web page somewhere, but I can't find
the URL now :-(

As for Orc ships - well... slow, lots of short-ranged weapons (massed C
batteries, probably) with a smattering of needles (to represent strange
Mekaniak weapons like Deth Rays or Shokk Attack Guns). Think Gargants in
space, like :-)

One more thing: GW ships are *HUGE*. If you use the ground/space
interface rules in More Thrust, multiply the number of soldiers you can
cram into one ship by a factor 2000 or so :-)

> Rick L. Mower wrote:

> Check out the new issue of white dwarf in there you will find a space

It does? Strange... the mechanics are lifted almost directly from Epic 40K,
but there are virtually no similarities with the FT game mechanics that I can
see except that both are about space combat.

I know GW isn't that popular around here, but this sort of accusations are
really getting ridiculous.