I was just wondering if anybody uses subs, and how do you play/design
them? I was thinking of either using a cloaking device, or ECM to allow them
to hide in a system, and take pot shots at merchantmen etc. Equiping them with
a Cl.1 bat and a P.Torp (or a missile) with a single PDS would be useful
against merchantmen while being cheap. Just thinking of a way to make small
ships useful in a strategic sence in comercial warfare (like the wolf packs in
WW2).
Any ideas for this?
> Bif Smith wrote:
> I was just wondering if anybody uses subs, and how do you play/design
There are two aspects of subs that are difficult to model in FT without
turning it into a naval miniatures game:
1) Torpedoes were more devastating than p-torps (relatively speaking)
as few merchies (besides the ones loaded with lumber) could survive even a
single hit, but the subs carried only a limited number (even the LA class
SSN's only carried 26 weapons).
2) Subs can fire torpedoes while submerged (cloaked), but have only limited
maneuverability and endurance (before nuclear power).
The first can be redressed by a new weapon system. Pulling numbers and effects
out of my ass, the launcher has a mass of three and can cover three arcs. Each
torpedo salvo has a mass of 2 and can engage a target at up to 30mu. To score
a hit, the launching vessel must roll equal to, or greater than, the thrust
used by the target. A hit causes 6d6 of damage, but a d6 of damage can be
exchanged
(before resolving the attack) to increase the to-hit roll by one. A
one-shot
torpedo rack has a mass of 4.
The second problem is solved by creating a battery bank system. Each battery
bank requires 5% of the vessel's mass and stores energy. Energy is needed to
cloak, apply thrust, and fire torpedoes. There are two levels of cloaking,
periscope and deep. Torpedoes can only be fired from periscope depth, and it
takes a turn to move between deep and periscope. Due to an instability in the
cloaking device, vessels on deep cloak are lost if they run out of stored
energy.
Convoy escorts need a device like a k-gun (depth charge thrower).
Escorts can detect subs passively at a range of six times the applied thrust
(less applied
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> On Sun, 29 Jul 2001, Bif Smith wrote:
> > Bif Smith wrote:
I'm guessing here, but this could be due to the technical limitations that one
cannot 'listen' during 'transmit' times. Therefore, one is blind for the first
biot of range equivalant to the length of the transmit pulse. Furthermore,
switchover time is required to go from transmit to listen, adding further
blind time and therefore range.
I could well be wrong, this is just the most obvious possibility that comes to
mind.
Cheers,
The Free Cal-Tex that I play has been experimenting with "subs" lately.
Their evolution: Tried cloaking device as per rules, but found that it feels a
bit difficult, but alot of fun. I self limited to ships at or under 25 tons,
with point costs doubled (total cost, doubled) for thier experimental state
(Yes, I double the cloak device too). No, this really isn't balanced, but made
me feel better about using them...:) ECM is totally inaffective, as would
Stealth if used (at least for now).
I load mine with a class 1 or 2, and MT missles. The MT's (Nuke, 2d6 damage)
feel right to me, with the right amount of damage (crippling or even
destroying most commerce ships, destroyers and lower)
I felt the cloak was realistic enough, as subs, when running deep couldn't
see, and periscope depth (with the advent of radar) was viewable by the enemy.
Some tinkering, yet to be tested: While cloaked, subs can't fire, but the
enemy can find and attack them thus:
Sensor role to "discover" they are there: Standard sensors, 5-6.
Enhanced: 4-6, Superior 3-6
Sensor role to target while cloaked: Standard: 6. Enhanced: 5-6
Superior:
4-6 Role per firecon. If you have a "lock" then you can fire any or
all
weapons. However, they are at +18 MU's for range. Minus 6 MU's per
firecon after the first.
Note: The + MU's is added to the current range... Thus a destroyer
with 2 firecons, that has locked in on a sub that's 10 MU's away, with both
firecons, is at 22 MU's with respect to weapons range that can attack, and
dice to role when attacking.
I use the "declare # of turns of cloak" with the only difference that the turn
they are "uncloaked" they can choose to remain so.
Rand.
> At 11:20 AM 7/28/01 +0100, you wrote:
> Bif Smith wrote:
> Yes, I was trying for a design within the FT system, without the need
The system has the same mass as a SML and magazine, but different effects. The
problem with using p-torps to represent torpedoes is that the sub never
has to surface to finish the merchies off with the deck gun. The reason that
Q-ships
worked was that the U-boats would not waste a torpedo on an unescorted
target. They would surface and shell the target until it sank. A merchant ship
is a
much better gun platform than most subs, so a Q-ship does not have to
much trouble sinking the surfaced sub before it can dive. As there is no limit
to
the number of p-torps that a tube can fire, it is a poor representative
of wet navy torpedoes.
Maybe we need to introduce a limit on the number of torpedoes that a
p-torp tube
can launch (say five each [How many FT games last that long?]) with an option
to sacrifice mass to carry more.
> > The second problem is solved by creating a battery bank system.
Each
> battery
Escorts
> can
G'day,
> Maybe we need to introduce a limit on
The poll I ran a year back on average game length showed:
"Average game length for vector was 3 turns, with the vast majority falling
within the range 2-6 and with the very occasional one out at 15+.
Whereas the average cinematic game lasts 7 turns, with most being done in
6-10 turns though a fair few last out to 15 turns (you also get the odd
one going longer, though you also get the very odd one being as short
turn-wise
as a normal vector game)."
I'm guessing things haven't changed too much since then.
Cheers
Beth
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