[FT] SMR's

While we're on the "missiles" topic, I've thought up other "loads" for
missiles:

G'day Laserlight,

> While we're on the "missiles" topic, I've thought up other "loads" for

Nice idea, but am I glad I'm not one of them!

> Penetration Aid

I like this one!

> (I'll let Oerjan come up with the costs for these <g>)

Best idea yet!;)

Cheers

Beth

> Laserlight wrote:

Interesting. It sounds more like the boarding torpedoes concept in Battlefleet
Gothic than any tactic that may be used in the GZG universe.

Let's see...
As a Marine commandant, I spend $1-2 million for equipment and training
for one PA trooper and then I shoot him out a tube at an enemy ship. :-)

> Penetration Aid

I like this one too. Given the fact that you're giving up the combat potential
for a missile salvo, these could have the same cost as the standard missile
salvos. Since the protection provided is minimal, these would be used for
massed missile shots. Three salvos of standard warheads has equivalent damage
probabilities as two standard with one ECM salvo.

In a message dated 11/4/99 11:09:46 PM Eastern Standard Time,
> laserlight@quixnet.net writes:

<< Penetration Aid Each missile in this rack carries spoofers, jammers, radar
targets, etc, to attract attention from PDS and help the "real" missiles get
 through.  Acts as a Screen-1 for all missiles within 6".  Reduce the
effective radius by 1" for each missile hit by PDS fire. >>

A more flexible system would be to put a jammer missle in the normal salvo
load. Maximum of five missles on target and the jammer only protects the salvo
it is in. This way you could spread the aim points of your missles and still
have them harder to hit.

> At 14:23 05/11/99 +1000, you wrote:

After the last lot of email I got I am serious begining to wonder about you
Beth.

Wilko.

> Powered Armour Marines...

> Penetration Aid

Can you just see the recruiting ads? "Come on kids, do your part for the
(D)eep (I)nsertion (C)ore"

Cheers

> Laserlight wrote:

> While we're on the "missiles" topic, I've thought up other "loads"
for
> missiles:

You timed it well. I started looking seriously at Schoon's boarding combat
mechanics yesterday and began adding various "delivery systems"
almost immediately; I've done Teleporters and Longboats/Wormpods so
far, but hadn't gotten around to Theban-style Sleds <g>

However, you may want to scratch the "each PA trooper rides a missile" PSB
blurb. If you use the MT numbers that'd put the maximum BF of such a salvo at
1.5 with a pretty good chance of not making even 1 BF... and
in other backgrounds - Gothic Thrust, for instance - it'd be even less
impressive :-/

> Penetration Aid

It'd be better to (explicitly) give them the same bonus as Heavy Fighters,
since screens don't normally protect against PDS and C1 batteries don't kill
missiles on a roll of "4" anyway. Yes, I know the
Heavy Fighter description calls this effect "level-1 screens", but it
also spells out exactly what is meant.

> Reduce the effective radius by 1" for each missile hit by PDS fire.

It'd have to "attack" one specific ship in order to let PDS shoot at it under
the current rules. Also, I'd rather make it affect "all *targets* within 6mu"
than "all *missiles* within 6 mu", since any enemy ships further than 6 mu
away from the PenAid salvo would automatically count it as a "miss" and ignore
it.

Later,

> However, you may want to scratch the "each PA trooper rides a

I didn't say "only one trooper to a missile", though

> Penetration Aid

"Make it so"

I'd also like "Enhanced SMR'" which would reduce the number of possible hits
in a salvo while increasing the likelihood of evading PDS.

> -----Original Message-----
[snip]

> > Penetration Aid
[snip]

[Bri]
Not if it is using ADFC/PDS. ADFC/PDS can extend the range of PDS up to
12".
However, as you pointed out PDS only works against fighters/missiles
targeting it or a friendly ship for ADFC/PDS (unless the rules have
changed
[Jon?]). And I think that the idea was that salvo missiles outside of
the 6" radius did not gain the bonus. And I agree that it should read
"protects Missile Salvos in rage as Heavy Fighters".

Someone suggested adding one missile to a pack to provide this benefit with a
maximum number of hits of 5. This may make it too powerful for the
cost/mass. If this option is used, I would impose a cost penalty and
have it read "The number of missiles that hit is reduced by one". This leaves
the possibility that the only missile left is the jammer missile. But again, I
like the idea of a separate salvo much better.

Another idea for Salvo Missiles is to have a "Control Salvo". The Control
Salvo has no warhead, but has a small AI and sensor package. Same
cost/mass
as regular salvo. Each missile in the Control Salvo may control one other
Salvo within a 12" radius. It allows the Salvos that are controlled to pick
a target rather than the "closest ship". Trade-offs: trade 1 salvo to
allow up to 6 other salvos to pick their target.

---

> On 5-Nov-99 at 00:13, ODUPSHAW3@cs.com (ODUPSHAW3@cs.com) wrote:

d6-1, on a roll of 1 the jammer hits and bounces. :)

> Date: Thu, 4 Nov 1999 23:06:39 -0500
[snip]

or rip off the Breaching Pod idea from Babylon 5.... i don't have my notes
handy to suggest rules tho.

> Laserlight wrote:

> >However, you may want to scratch the "each PA trooper rides a

"Each trooper rides a missile..." True, you didn't; you only said no trooper
is split between two or more missiles <g>

> >> Penetration Aid

I'll look at both variants. Not before Monday, though :-/

> Bell, Brian K wrote:

> > It'd be better to (explicitly) give them the same bonus as Heavy

> [Bri]

Debatable. ADFC/PDS can engage missiles attacking a ship within 6mu of
the ADFC/PDS, but the point where you put the missile marker may be
only the point where they start looking for a target. After that, they may
maneuver for the attack (ie, move closer to their target) or may
detonate where they are (ie, bomb-pumped lasers or something like
that); the rules don't say.

Either way, if the PenAid is not within 6mu of any enemy ship even an ADFC
will ignore it since it can't attack anything...

> However, as you pointed out PDS only works against fighters/missiles

Not that I've seen. The FT2 ADAF could have engaged non-attacking
missiles within 6mu, but the ADFC is not allowed to do this.

> And I think that the idea was that salvo missiles outside of the 6"

Again it depends on how you interpret the missiles' attack. If they "fire"
from where the marker is put they don't move outside the 6mu radius; if they
make an attack run to close with their target from the point where the marker
was placed they may move outside the jammers' radius.

Laserlight's original version can be interpreted in either of these ways, but
my first impression of it was that it leaned more towards the "missiles fire
from the position of the marker". My suggestion is definitely a "missiles make
an attack run from the position of the
marker" variant, but it is less open to different interpretations :-/

> Another idea for Salvo Missiles is to have a "Control Salvo". The

Ouch. That would be worth *very* much, particularly when fighting NSL
and other low-thrust fleets. Probably considerably more so than
Oliver's "one missile per salvo carries jammers" version.

Regards,

In a message dated 11/04/1999 10:09:09 PM Central Standard Time,
> laserlight@quixnet.net writes:

> While we're on the "missiles" topic

Hi guys! I'm fairly new to the list. I've been lurking for a short while now,
and now I'm ready to contribute something to the list. I recently acquired the
EFSB and I am very interested to hear some of the conversions for heavy beams
and energy mines that listers have developed.

Meanwhile, I considered an e-mine conversion that is essentially a
missile salvo carrying antimatter warheads. They operate like standard
load-outs
with the following exceptions:

1. Antimatter SMs have no secondary movement toward any target because they
are area-effect.  They simply detonate in the normal SM attack phase.

2.  The area of effect of this ordinance is a six-inch radius from the
point of detonation. All vessels, fighter groups, and missiles within a
one-inch
radius take damage totalling one die per missile in the salvo. The damage
value of the attack drops one die for every inch outward from the center.
Point defense that is in range can defend against antimatter missiles
regularly.

It is my belief (I haven't tested these) that these salvos take up as much
space as ER load-outs, perhaps more.  At first glance I can see these
weapons being used as antifighter weapons. If something like this has already
been
covered and dismissed, I apologize ahead of time.  :-)  In any event,
I'd like some feedback from you all.

> Meanwhile, I considered an e-mine conversion that is essentially a

I like this idea. Of course, I would, since I've defined the Alarishi Empire
as being great believers in (and manufacturers of) antimatter for all
purposes. Just make sure you don't lose that SMR to a threshold check!

You mentioned (for this and the MT/AM missile) dropping 1 die per 1MU
radius--I'd specify that as "drop the largest die".  Thus if you roll
3452, within 1MY he takes 14 damage, 2MU = 9 damage, 3MU = 5, and 4MU = 2

In a message dated 11/06/1999 9:00:31 AM Central Standard Time,
> laserlight@quixnet.net writes:

> >Meanwhile, I considered an e-mine conversion that is essentially a

Thanks! You are absolutely right. I am so used to doing this with Champions
that I didn't even mention it.

Bill

G'day Tony,

> After the last lot of email I got I am serious begining to wonder

I don't know whether to be pleased or hurt!;)

Beth