[FT] NI / FCS and other things (long)

On Fri, 26 Feb 1999 09:09:21 -0500 "John M. Atkinson"
> <john.m.atkinson@erols.com> writes:

Hehehehe, yeah, go ahead, make my day. We go bout lohdud fuhr bar round hair.
If you can translate that, you can have all my encryption stuff.

8^)

On Fri, 26 Feb 1999 11:51:40 -0500 "John M. Atkinson"
> <john.m.atkinson@erols.com> writes:
====

WHOA!! Now thats a fleet!!

Another digest multi-reply

JClem> Anyway, even though the NI is JClem> paranoid about its facilities, no
facility is JClem> perfectly sealable.

Granted. However, Skunkworks technology has a major tole in primary NI
defense, plus NI makes ~25% of its GNP through trade in military services in
technology, much of which is developed there. This isn't just any facility.
It's not even just any high security facility. Aside from finding it and
infiltrating it undetected (forcing your way in would be pretty bloody), you'd
have to be able to speak and code
fluently in Hebrew (without a southern drawl ;-)  ) to get anything at
all, then get out with the data and/or materials.

JClem> Having been unable to obtain or JClem> successfully copy the cloaking
tech of the Big JClem> 4, the NCSN mounted an operation to obtain it.

Cloaking tech would be _much_ easier to get than stealth.
Again, Sale or parallel engineering is another matter.

JClem> The details are, needless to say, classified, JClem> but they managed
to get hold of it somehow.

Yeah, the NCS inflitrator was booted uncerenmoniously from the facility, so he
went and bought it from the NI Dep't of Military Trade. Now, how
he justified the missing credits from the Intelligence budget.. _that's_
classified.

JClem> I'd love to take you on in some PbEM
JClem> action, detailing the short lived NI/NCS war of 2186.

Short lived indeed. Assuming this theft could have happened, the "war" would
consiste of a pusuit force following the escaping theft ship to its first jump
stop and obliterating it. Now if there were NCS friendlies at that stop
waiting to protect it, then there would be a battle, and pending the outcome
there would be an international incident. If the NCS got away with the data,
there would be raids on NCS science and construction facilities, and any NCS
stealth ship bult or under construction would be targetted by raids.

The real question is why steal something from a power that would be willing to
sell or trade for it? That would make for just as rich timeline development.
NI does not start conflicts (IF occasionally excepted), but it does end them.
No DS or SG here, so it would have to be fleet-only if we were to do
anything.

JTL> Guys,
JTL> It was a joke!   I was not serious about the shootout.

_I_ know it was a joke. I just don't want to promote NCS delusions of
grandeur. And if a pasting of a squadron of theirs is what that will
take, then so be it. ;-)

Laser > Noam, if you need some backup in this intellectual Laser > property
dispute, theAlarishi Empire is always willing to Laser > engage in joint
training exercisesalongside the NI Navy.

The funny thing is It's not really an intellectual property dispute. If NCS
wants to use stealth, then by all means. I tried to write it up as a
balanced system anyone could use, and am _happy_ that someone else wants
to use it. What bridled me was the _method_ of obtaining the technology,
since I would like to have it that infiltrating the skunkworks backed
and protected by 60+ years of paranoia would be beyond any intelligence
group short of the big 2.

Laser> On a more serious note, we need to rein in "ubertech" Laser> that
doesn't come fromthe Big Four.

If a system/rule is balanced, it's not ubertech.

JTL> Personally, I like Noams idea about the alternate fleet. JTL> I feel that
ideas that need to be tested should be JTL> presented to the list, but not as
part of the GZGpedia.

I'll be working on it slowly - the price of trying to please everyone.
If I get in in enough time, I'll have some more
stealth playtesting at GZG-ECC tomorrow.

Laser> Anyway, if the Big Guys Laser> haven't discovered it, it's probably not
because Laser> their militaries are oldand stodgy. Consequently, Laser> it's
unlikely that minor powers will have much Laser> new tech.

If it's not in the FB, that doeasn't mean it can't exist. Stealth, (for
example) costs alot of mass, and therefore has some serious drawbacks such as
weak hulls or lower thrust, and smaller weapons compliment. This does not fit
in any of the big 4's preffered fleet construction, so, even if they had
developed the tech, they would not build many ships to use it. Lots of people
have thought up other 'new technologies' for use
in canon and non-canon environments. I think the limitations on canon
weapons /systems is artificially imposed by time and manpower needed to
develop, playtest, edit, and publish rules books in a timely manner. If we
gave Jon infinite time and playtest resources, I'm sure he could fit a large
and balanced variety of systems into the canon rules.

That being said, some minor powers (like my conception of NI) base their
survival in part on being on the technological cutting edge. That has enabled
their survival and allows them to compete economically in a
galaxy dominated by the big 4 - they can create/produce things that the
big 4 can't or won't. [Historical] NI would have economically collapsed
without profit from military sales and mercenary operations during the hard
times of the 1st and 2nd solar wars. It would have been destroyed outright in
2173 by the numerically superior IF force if not for superior technology.

> Izenberg, Noam wrote:

> Short lived indeed. Assuming this theft could have happened, the "war"

*whistle* Wanna borrow a BatRon? Ever since the last IF War, we've been
needing some additional live-fire exercises.

Maybe we could even annex the NCS as a protectorate... Not in keeping with the
theme (haha), but at least we could force them to insert translating
algorithms to remove any trace of a drawl from their
e-mail.

> That being said, some minor powers (like my conception of NI) base

Only a few hundred million Romans, with a few Corps, but those are the
best-equipped troops out there, IMNSHO (If anyone differs, they are free
to try to change my mind at the Con--I'm bringing all my stuff for some
one-off games.)

> JClem> Having been unable to obtain or

Okay, ya lost me here; could you elaborate?

Mk

> j a c wrote:

> Hehehehe, yeah, go ahead, make my day. We go bout lohdud fuhr bar

Note: I live in Virginia.  When I get agitated/sarcastic/drunk the drawl
comes out a bit.

The only reason you little people get away with 'pulling the lion's tail' is
that the lions are so busy with each other. Check the Orbat for the Imperial
High Space Fleet at
http://www.angelfire.com/va/basileus/oob.html

And consider we have 3 sector fleets. Of course one is comitted to watching
the FSE, another to the IF, and the third splits attention between the
Ukrainians, the Romanov Hegemony, and helping with the IF, this leaves us with
few free assets.

Jim drawled:
> Hehehehe, yeah, go ahead, make my day. We go bout lohdud fuhr bar

You may want to change your load unless you really expect to encounter some
in space, Jim, although I understand the ESU is working on gene-tailored
bears as rather over-the-top guard dogs.

> j a c wrote:

> Hehehehe, yeah, go ahead, make my day. We go bout lohdud fuhr bar

its: 'roun' heah'. (hee ya)

Bi ya'll:

> j a c wrote:

Jim's has a good deal of mountain twang in it, as opposed to John's drawl.
For the incredulous--yes, people do talk this way.  My job involves a
lot of phone work, and my territory has covered the entire southeastern US.
Someone from Georgia or Alabama does not sound the same as someone from
Tennessee or the Virginia mountains...and thank God, we don't sound the same
as the damyankees at all. <g>

Loaded for bear, eh?

[quoted original message omitted]

> Michael Brown wrote:

> Hehehehe, yeah, go ahead, make my day. We go bout lohdud fuhr bar

In a planetary assault, obviously Drop Bear.

> On Sun, 28 Feb 1999, Alan E & Carmel J Brain wrote:

> Michael Brown wrote:

Aaagghh! Hideous Yankee accents and bad Australian puns in the SAME
email...<brain implodes>

Doesn't the Geneva Convention have some protocol forbidding this combination?

> > Hehehehe, yeah, go ahead, make my day. We go bout lohdud fuhr bar

Brian Burger, obviously not paying attention, said:
> Aaagghh! Hideous Yankee accents and bad Australian puns in the SAME

No, no, no, Brian. That's a Southern accent (mountain variety). A Yankee
accent sounds entirely different. Calling a Southerner a Yankee can get you
shot.

> On Sat, 27 Feb 1999, Laserlight wrote:

> >> > Hehehehe, yeah, go ahead, make my day. We go bout lohdud fuhr

> From up here, you're all yanks, I'm afraid... :) Especially the ones

I suppose you could argue that Yankees are the northern lot, whilst Yanks
encompasses all of you...At least we can agree that the Australian pun was
indeed horrible?

(and that this is insanely off-topic?)

On Fri, 26 Feb 1999 18:13:58 -0500 Laserlight <laserlight@cwix.com>
writes:
> You may want to change your load unless you really expect to encounter

On Fri, 26 Feb 1999 18:36:57 -0500 Laserlight <laserlight@cwix.com>
writes:
> Jim's has a good deal of mountain twang in it, as opposed to John's

On Fri, 26 Feb 1999 17:51:27 -0800 Michael Brown <mkkabrow@wco.com>
writes:
> Loaded for bear, eh?
====

Well done!

On Sun, 28 Feb 1999 13:26:12 +1000 Alan E & Carmel J Brain
> <aebrain@dynamite.com.au> writes:

On Fri, 26 Feb 1999 15:31:21 -0800 John Leary
> <john_t_leary@pronetusa.net> writes: