I've been reading posts on the list about games with 20, 30, and even 60
(!!)
ships *per side*, and I'm starting to wonder if anyone actually plays the
games out to completion.:) Also, how many of you playing these huge games are
taking an entire weekend to run these monstrosities? It would be an
interesting correlation to see if the nominal allocation of gaming time is the
determining factor on the game size <g>. The games that I find myself playing
tend to be on the small size - 500 to 1000 points (fleet book) per side.
Part
of that *is* determined by alloted game time - I'm normally limited to
gaming after hours during the week, so our normal maximum game length is in
the 2.5 to 3 hour range. It *is* rather difficult to play a good game with a
large number of ships per side when you run out of time after the 2nd or 3rd
turn.
. . .
-MWS- spake thusly upon matters weighty:
> I've been reading posts on the list about games with 20, 30, and even
Usually to the point where the victory is not in any doubt or for about three
to four hours. A lot of times, its pretty obvious what'll happen by then.
Also, how many of you playing these huge games
> are taking an entire weekend to run these monstrosities?
My group plays weeknights, usually after work, after pizza, after warming up
with some card games of various natures. So we don't usually get spooled up
till 7:30 or later and we usually finish around midnight.
It would be an
> interesting correlation to see if the nominal allocation of gaming
There is obviously a practical maximum.
The games that I find myself playing
> tend to be on the small size - 500 to 1000 points (fleet book) per
That would suggest battles of 10-20 ships per side. But OTOH, when
you get more ships on the board, the first few turns are a heck of a lot more
bloody and a lot more things die, so it helps to compensate for larger ship
counts.
It *is* rather difficult to play a good game with a large
> number of ships per side when you run out of time after the 2nd or 3rd
I think we're usually (in a big battle) on to about the 6th or so turn anyway.
/************************************************
> On Mon, 18 Jan 1999, Thomas Barclay wrote:
[snip]
> My group plays weeknights, usually after work, after pizza, after
Since we're currently playing after work at a local game store, we normally
get going around 6:30 or 7:00 and end around 9:00 - for some odd reason
they like closing up on time.:)
[snip]
> The games that I find myself playing tend to be on the small size -
Err - no. Try more like 3 to 6 ships per side. 1000 points doesn't buy
very much using Fleet Book design rules. For instance, the last 1000 pt game I
was in (last week), I had 3 ships total:
1 CVE: 110 mass, 442 pts, 3 fighter groups (1 hvy, 2 std), 1 Class 2
6-arc,
2 Class 1 6-arc, 2 FiCon, 4 PDS, level 1 shields, 4 thrust
1 BC: 108 mass, 383 pts, 1 fighter group (std), 2 Class 3 3-arc, 2
Class 2
3-arc, 2 Class 1 6-arc, 3 FiCon, 3 PDS, level 1 shields, 5
armor,
4 thrust
1 CL: 52 mass, 175 pts, 1 Pulse Torp 1-arc, 2 Class 2 3-arc, 2 Class
1
6-arc, 2 FiCon, 2 PDS, level 1 shields, 4 armor, 4 thrust
See? Not really a lot you can buy with only 1000 pts. My opponent had only 4
ships - he took stock FSE ships (1 BB, 1 BC, 2 DD), and if I hadn't been
rolling demon dice that night (I used up 2 months worth of "roll 6s" karma:)
he would have won rather handily. 1000 pts will normally buy you 1 small
capital ship (BB/BC), a couple of cruisers, and a pair of tin cans if
you are lucky.
> -MWS- wrote:
Well the games that run into the 40 to 60 ship range have a
duration of 2.5 the 3.5 (sometimes 4) hours. Please note that we
do not use the FT/MT movement system as it is to time consuming for
movement and firing.
'HOUSE RULES' rules The ships move in order from low thrust to high thrust 1)
FT missiles.
2) Thrust 1/2.
3) Thrust 3/4.
4) Thrust 5/6.
5) Thrust 7/8.
6) Fighters. Firing occures in the reverse order.
You can check out the Monster Game we played for the making of Adler Tag here:
http://www.erols.com/los1/ft/sawmill.htm
It was played to completion in less than a day...
Los
> -MWS- wrote:
> I've been reading posts on the list about games with 20, 30, and even
> On Mon, 18 Jan 1999, -MWS- wrote:
> On Mon, 18 Jan 1999, Thomas Barclay wrote:
You need to find a games store like our local one here that our group
plays DS2/Sg2 at some evenings. Open til Midnight every night; and
they've been known to be open a lot later if there's enough people present who
don't want to leave...our longest DS2 game went until 0200, nearly...great
store:)
> Brian Burger wrote:
> You need to find a games store like our local one here that our group
Adventure Games Plus here in Milwaukee is the same way. The game room and
store are completely seperate. So when the store closes at 8 pm, those in the
game room can play for as long as they want. Pity there's no one who wants to
play FT or any other GZG.
> On Mon, 18 Jan 1999, Los wrote:
summarising from Los's comprehensive illustrated account:
NSL 44 ships, 16 fighter groups, 14800 pts KV 22 ships, 5 fighter groups,
10500 pts
1-0 Away win to the NSL
Commenting on his preparations for the match, Los writes "Any space mini that
was mounted was pressed into service on one side or the other. (I ran out of
fighters so we used quarters with a tiny die representing
strength)". What about duration? "We started at about 1 pm (w/ Prep) and
it lasted till 10pm". Nine hours is really not bad going for an engagement
this size.
> -MWS- wrote:
FT is remarkably quick once you get the hang of it - me and a friend
used to warm up with a ~6 ship a side FT battle before spending the rest of
the day playing a single 8000 point a side Sp*** M***ne battle, which we often
didn't finish. half the time was looking up rules, which we never, ever,
had to to do for FT. we could have gone to 20 ships each and played it out
in a day (roughly 1000-1800). mind you, we used ft2.0, without fighters
and using squadron maneuvering.
A question: does time to play scale linearly with force size? if you use
squadron orders more or less throughout, order time should be the same for
small and large forces (ish), movement-plotting should take the same
time, physically moving the minis will take proportionally longer, and firing
should take longer as there are simply more dice.
Tom
> -MWS- wrote:
Let's see, last two games I had were 2750 and 1200 pts respectively. My 2750
fleet was:
Jeanne D'Arc + 7 fighters
Jerez Suffren 6 Triestes
10 or so 1-shot Minervas
Game took 3 hours, 7 turns.
My 1200 fleet was Jerez Suffren 4 Triestes
3 1-shot Minervas
+ 3 Transports I had to escort.
Game took 2 hours, 6 turns.
> Thomas Anderson wrote:
> A question: does time to play scale linearly with force size? if you
For Operation SAWMILL, the KraVak did most all of their operations under
strict Squadron based Rules. They manuever like flocks of sparrows. The NSL
had four groups that also manuevered together. We tried to minimize the amount
of time spent writing stuff down and maximize the time spent making firing
decisions. Neither Kr'rt nor I are the type that sits their and plans every
potential movement plot that could occur to the nth degree since battles don't
happen like that. (We all know wargamers like that Counting every exact factor
etc). Also the battle was being done to porvide fodder for teh Rot Hafen
story. We would rather spend are time postulating how many guys are being
sucked out of the one meter diameter hole that was just punched into this or
that ship or wonder about the life or death struggles taking place inside a
stricken Cruiser as damage control parties struggle to get the Power core back
on line before it explodes....
> -MWS- wrote:
> I've been reading posts on the list about games with 20, 30, and even
If you include "until one side breaks off into FTL" into "to completion", yes.
> Also, how many of you playing these huge games
I don't. 20 ships per side (roughly equal mix of capitals, cruisers and
escorts) usually take about 2-3 hours to play using pre-written orders
if both players are reasonably used to it; if there are newbies present the
battles tend to be smaller but still take as much time. Large battles
take longer, of course, but not that much - I've never seen an FT game
run more than 6 hours, and the thing that took the most time then was
moving all the d*****d missiles (MT-style, about 50 of them; there were
approx. 80 ships on the table all in all).
[On playing small battles, 500-1000 FTFB points]
> Part of that *is* determined by alloted game time - I'm normally
after the 2nd or 3rd turn.
See above. I find it somewhat surprising that you can't finish bigger battles
in that time, but then I've been playing for the past five years
or so - it may be routine, I don't know.
Regards,