Well, here's an idea I've been kicking around for a week or two now... it's a
fledgling idea, and though maybe I'd toss it to you folks for feedback...
The Stellar Dragon Clans Designing space dragons is very similar to designing
Sa'Vasku ships. In fact, the Sa'Vasku were the initial starting point, to
which various modifications were made that seemed more fitting to the dragon
theme. One thing to keep in mind that space dragons were specifically designed
with a theme in mind, not tatical capability. So while a skilled commander may
be able to use space dragons to some devastating effect, don't expect them to
win every battle you play. Another thing to keep in mind is that while many of
the dragon weapons are designed to have effects similar to a lot of the
weapons of other races, and may seem
rather powerful comparatively, dragons will rarely have more than 3-4
weapons. 1. Space Dragon design follows most of the rules for the Sa'Vasku
with a key few changes. Those changes are: A. Dragons do not consume biomass.
Instead, they have high point costs to replace biomass consumption. B. Dragons
don't use Sa'Vasku power generator rules. Instead, they have a single heart.
The heart makes threshold checks like any other system, but failures reduce it
by thirds. Power generation capacity is listed by thirds, in a similar manner
to how power generators are listed, with the larger amounts (in case power
generation isn't evenly divisible by 3) listed last. EXAMPLE: 8 power points
would be listed
2/3/3.
C. Dragonets (fighters) and Clutches (hanger bays) are costed and treated like
human fighters instead of Sa'Vasku drones. D. The "Repair" pool is now renamed
to the "Healing" pool.
Limitations 1. Dragons have STRONG bodies, at least 40% of a dragon is body.
2. All dragon weapons, with the exception of PDS, only fire in the
forward firing arcs (FP/F/FS).
3. Dragons are limited to 1 "Cortex Node/FireCon".
4. While Dragons can have more than one breath weapon, only one can be fired
during a round. Special breath weapons require a separate mount from beam
breath weapons.
5. Dragon beam weapons have a limit of five range bands.
6. Dragons are limited to a total of 2 wing weapons. Wing weapons follow the
standard dragon weapon rules (forward arcs only), and can only be standard
beam weapons.
7. Dragons are limited to a total of 2 pairs of claws.
Weapons 1. Claws: Take 5% mass per pair. Claw strikes are treated similar to
ramming attempts. Claw strikes must be declared in the movement orders, and
the dragon must end it's movement within 3 inches of it's target. Dragon rolls
a D6 and on a 5, one pair of claws strike successfully, on a 6, both pairs (if
dragon has more than one pair) strike. Damage is 1D6 per pair times velocity.
Additionally, all surface systems (weapons, sensors, drive systems) make a
threshold check at one level higher than the current threshold.
2. Beam Weapons (Breath, Gaze, & Wingtips): Dragon beam weapons fire like
Sa'Vasku stinger nodes, with each die of damage costing a number of power
points per range band. The cost of each range band is twice the
range band before it. EXAMPLE: 1/2/4/8/16. The actual effects of the
beams however can be choosen each round at the time of firing. Dragon beam
weapons can be set as either Standard beams, EMP beams, or Grazer
beams. The costs of Standard Beams is 1/2/4/8/16; EMP Beams cost
2/4/8/16/32; and Grazer Beams cost 4/8/16/32/64.
3. Special Weapons (Breath): Dragons have a secondary breath weapon that acts
as their special effects or heavy weapon. In it's least powerful role, the
weapon can act like the Sa'Vasku pod launcher, firing the equivalent of Leech
pods or the human Pulse Torpedo. The cost of Pulse Torpedos are 7 points per
shot and the Leech pods are 14 points. In it's most powerful role, the weapon
fires like the Nova Cannon or Wave Gun, costing 24 points for Wave Gun effects
and 40 points for Nova Cannon effects. In either of the more powerful modes,
the dragon cannot fire any other weapons, and may not have enough points left
over for defenses. The actual firing of either the Nova Cannon or Wave Gun
effects must be notated in the movement orders and the dragon cannot actually
manouver or use thrust during that turn. The Speacial Breath Weapon costs
twice as much as a normal Breath Weapon.
4. Empathic Blast: Dragons have a psi weapon that's similar to an EMP beam.
The blast effects all systems on a target, including core systems. All systems
take a threshold check and on a 5 are lost for 1 round, on a 6 are lost for
two rounds. All systems are rolled for once per die until a system fails the
check. Damage Control parties can be used as normal to negate the effects.
I've also had a few thoughts about doing space whales...
I forgot to add this extra little bit of thematic info...
Age can be a rough indicator of size, giving way to the theory that dragons
grow and become more powerful as they get older.
Hatchlings = 50 Mass or less; Youth = 50-100 Mass; Adult = 100-150 Mass;
Elder = 150-200 Mass, Ancient = 200+ Mass.
The terms Greater and Lesser can be used to indicate a dragon at the
higher or lower end of a size/age class.
Also figured that generally, you'd see the following comparative
organization... with the listings in order of commonality
Amphipteres (Dragons with wings, but no limbs/claws) : Carriers,
Cruisers, Scouts Dragons: Cruisers, Corvettes, Scouts Wyrms: Battleships &
Dreadnaughts Wyverns: Destroyers, Cruisers, Corvettes, Carriers
> Rrok Anroll <coldnovemberrain_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
Well, here's an idea I've been kicking around for a week or two now... it's a
fledgling idea, and though maybe I'd toss it to you folks for feedback...
G'day,
I'm sure someone will at some point comment on points, flexibility (or lack
of) of a single fire control equivalent....but for my part
Coooooooooooooollll;)
What are you going to use for figs?
Cheers
I like it, as an alien race idea why not.......)
Heh... actually you mention the one point of contention.... I've looked around
a little.. haven't really found many figs that would be good.... or at least
not to my liking... I'm almost afraid I may very well have to make my own
(which won't be all that great considering I'm not much or an artist... or I'd
have to hire a sculpter... which would be expensive... although if anyone has
seen some dragon figs of the right size.... I'd love some links!
Beth.Fulton@csiro.au wrote:G'day,
I'm sure someone will at some point comment on points, flexibility (or lack
of) of a single fire control equivalent....but for my part
Coooooooooooooollll;)
What are you going to use for figs?
Cheers
Beth
Well I'm glad to hear that they've already generated some interest.... As I
mentioned... I also had an idea or two for space whales as well.... although
the whales would almost definitely be more of a flavor thing... perhaps more
useful as a "referree fleet" than an actual player fleet.. The general idea
would be for the whales to be designed similar to how the dragon rules are...
the main difference is that the whales (at least as I see them) would have
about maybe three or four weapons total... I figure the empathic blast like
the dragons have... maybe an area effect varient though... like a Sa'Vasku
Intercepter pods version of it. And instead of the claw strike, the whales
would have a tail slap, or even modified ramming rules.
Heh... actually you mention the one point of contention.... I've looked around
a little.. haven't really found many figs that would be good.... or at least
not to my liking... I'm almost afraid I may very well have to make my own
(which won't be all that great considering I'm not much or an artist... or I'd
have to hire a sculpter... which would be expensive... although if anyone has
seen some dragon figs of the right size.... I'd love some links!
You know there was a board game out that had a ton of plastic flying dragons
that are about the right size. I don't know if it's still available or not.
I'll do a net search and let you know.
That's also doable.......but I'm partial to the dragons.......)
Don
[quoted original message omitted]
Yeah, so am I, but I've always been into dragons... the whale idea was
partially from a rpg book I saw where they included 'voidwhales' as something
to encounter in space... for some reason the idea kinda stuck in my brain....
like I said... I'd doubt it ever be a good player fleet... but as a scenario
obstacle... it could be interesting...
I don't know... I've always been into flavor things... won't be suprised if I
found a few more ideas lurking around.... although a buddy of mine just
mentioned to me that one idea would be instead of having the dragons be the
actual entites themselves.... have them simply be the hull... with the other
stuff build on to them... space age versions of the elephant war platforms
from lord of the rings......
> Don M <dmaddox1@hot.rr.com> wrote:
That's also doable.......but I'm partial to the dragons.......)
Don
[quoted original message omitted]
> On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 Beth.Fulton@csiro.au wrote:
Anybody know if this toy is still in stores?
> On Sat, 11 Dec 2004, Rrok Anroll wrote:
> I also had an idea or two for space whales as well....
After seeing Moya and Talen from FarScape, please post your whale ideas. I'm
interested in reading them.
And think about very large insects too. I've got a few wizkids minis without
riders that need idea..
http://www.wizkidsgames.com/mageknight/figuregallery.asp?unitid=1085
(That's the best picture I can find in short order.)
I don't know... I've always been into flavor things... won't be suprised if I
found a few more ideas lurking around.... although a buddy of mine just
mentioned to me that one idea would be instead of having the dragons be the
actual entites themselves.... have them simply be the hull... with the other
stuff build on to them... space age versions of the elephant war platforms
from lord of the rings......
I like the Howda/War Platform idea, added to your standard dragon stats
would make for a more flexible fighting machine. Can make the crews of a
reptilian race in an almost symbiotic relationship with the
dragons.......Twist this a bit to where crew quality goes up or down depending
on how the dragon is doing in the fight.......)
Something I kinda screwed up on here.... Breath, Gaze and Wingtip Beam weapons
are 2 Mass, three arcs, just like Stinger Nodes.... And Special Breat Weapons
are 4 Mass....
Rrok Anroll <coldnovemberrain_2000@yahoo.com> wrote: 2. Beam Weapons
(Breath, Gaze, & Wingtips): Dragon beam weapons fire like Sa'Vasku stinger
nodes, with each die of damage costing a number of power points per range
band. The cost of each range band is twice the range band
before it. EXAMPLE: 1/2/4/8/16. The actual effects of the beams however
can be choosen each round at the time of firing. Dragon beam weapons can be
set as either Standard beams, EMP beams, or Grazer beams. The costs
of Standard Beams is 1/2/4/8/16; EMP Beams cost 2/4/8/16/32; and Grazer
Beams cost 4/8/16/32/64.
3. Special Weapons (Breath): Dragons have a secondary breath weapon that acts
as their special effects or heavy weapon. In it's least powerful role, the
weapon can act like the Sa'Vasku pod launcher, firing the equivalent of Leech
pods or the human Pulse Torpedo. The cost of Pulse Torpedos are 7 points per
shot and the Leech pods are 14 points. In it's most powerful role, the weapon
fires like the Nova Cannon or Wave Gun, costing 24 points for Wave Gun effects
and 40 points for Nova Cannon effects. In either of the more powerful modes,
the dragon cannot fire any other weapons, and may not have enough points left
over for defenses. The actual firing of either the Nova Cannon or Wave Gun
effects must be notated in the movement orders and the dragon cannot actually
manouver or use thrust during that turn. The Speacial Breath Weapon costs
twice as much as a normal Breath Weapon.
Give it a spelljammer look for real flavor? wooden decks and turrets... Phase
Ballistas and Pulse Trebechets? With elemental powered Lightning batteries
instead of beams?
Don M <dmaddox1@hot.rr.com> wrote:I don't know... I've always been into flavor
things... won't be suprised if I found a few more ideas lurking around....
although a buddy of mine just mentioned to me that one idea would be instead
of having the dragons be the actual entites themselves.... have them simply be
the hull... with the other stuff build on to them... space age versions of the
elephant war platforms from lord of the rings......
I like the Howda/War Platform idea, added to your standard dragon stats
would make for a more flexible fighting machine. Can make the crews of a
reptilian race in an almost symbiotic relationship with the
dragons.......Twist this a bit to where crew quality goes up or down depending
on how the dragon is doing in the fight.......)
Don
In a message dated 12/12/2004 2:33:11 AM Mountain Standard Time,
> coldnovemberrain_2000@yahoo.com writes:
Give it a spelljammer look for real flavor? wooden decks and turrets... Phase
Ballistas and Pulse Trebechets? With elemental powered Lightning batteries
instead of beams? Another 'idea' I'd had for conversion... Spelljammer to
FT...:::sigh::: so many ideas... so little time:o)
Randy
Not a bad idea. Other Sci Fi Genres such as Star Wars (mostly the WEG RPG),
Star Trek, DIsney etc. have had some kind of "dragon". Space is full of races
and object uncharted, so Why not.
however, I am totally opposed to any psionic PSB entering the game
period -- That's what I liked about FT in the first place was no
psionics/tlelpathy etc.. Other Sci Fi backgrounds like BG, B5, ST, SW,
Traveller... have psionic PBS and there are generally no bounds for it excet
that it is "Morally wrong to do X" which doesn't really stop
anybody. the next thing will be 'dragon' players loading the up and
enhancing on the psionics and blasting everything on the board before the game
starts, so then what's the point of playing?
Dragon also need to add 'armor' as the scales (assuming they are reptilian)
harden. Also for clans, Will is be norse vs Medevil vs asian dragons?
> Rrok Anroll <coldnovemberrain_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
C. Dragonets (fighters) and Clutches (hanger bays) are costed and treated like
human fighters instead of Sa'Vasku drones. D. The "Repair" pool is now renamed
to the "Healing" pool.
Limitations 1. Dragons have STRONG bodies, at least 40% of a dragon is body.
3. Dragons are limited to 1 "Cortex Node/FireCon".
Weapons 4. Empathic Blast: Dragons have a psi weapon that's similar to an EMP
beam. The blast effects all systems on a target, including core systems. All
systems take a threshold check and on a 5 are lost for 1 round, on a 6 are
lost for two rounds. All systems are rolled for once per die until a system
fails the check. Damage Control parties can be used as normal to negate the
effects.
I've also had a few thoughts about doing space whales...
> Thomas Westbrook wrote:
> Traveller . . . have psionic PBS and there are generally no bounds for
> it excet that it is "Morally wrong to do X" which doesn't really stop
That's the key, one generally *has* to put bounds on it. One has to do like
they do in the Hero system RPG. You focus on *effects*, not *causes*.
So in Hero, it doesn't matter if your power is a.45 automatic, a cosmic laser
beam, a wind blast,
Dragonlance board game. I have a copy of it at home.
Brendan 'Neath Southern Skies
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> Dragonlance board game. I have a copy of it at home.
By TSR...
Six player colors, with five approximately 2 inch dragons in flight (winged)
in each color. I recall much chagrin in trying to move the dragons and having
them clumsily fall off their bases, or the bases popping out of the studded
coins that were used to represent altitude.
All the pieces were the same soft poly-something plastic from which the
Buck Rogers Battle in the XXV Century space ships were also made; there is a
greasy feel to them, though I suppose that could be THICK mould release.
These are a little bigger than the Dragon Lords, I think, and a bit on the
un-detailed side, but as this never was a popular game, you should find
it for a song, and for thirty flying dragons, that can't be bad.
The_Beast
That's the one!
http://www.drachenlanze.de/archiv/rezensionen/dl_brettspiel_scan.htm
Dragonlance board game. I have a copy of it at home.
Brendan 'Neath Southern Skies
Well I myself have nothing against psionics and magic being used in most
games... as long as theres a proper approach to it... I totally agree that
without the proper approach, then magic and psionics can spoil the game almost
as easily and as quickly as the words themselves are spoken... to me it would
perfectly okay to use psionics and magic... provided that you try to use most
of what's already there for the
rules... for instance... I could see Mage/Warlock fleets... or just
plain spelljammer battles... just use the rules that are already there to
represent the effects as much as possible, for instance... catapults that hurl
flaming projectiles could be pulse torpedos, lightning ballistas would be an
example of beam batteries, and so on... you'll notice that the rules I used
for the empathic blast really aren't anything more than the EMP playtest rules
given for the ORC fleets... and the Claw Strike is nothing more than a
modification of the ramming rules given in FT2. Al! so don't forget that the
dragon's are limited to one target each turn.
Sorry if I left the armor part out... armor is done as normal... like I
said... >start< with the Sa'Vasku rules... then use the mentioned
differences... And armor can be whatever, scales for reptilian, hardened
leather for avian, heck, it can be layers of extra-fluffy pillows in
case your dragons are the stuff of dreams
Something else I didn't mention because I was only toying with the idea but
went ahead and discarded it... The smaller dragons (Hatchlings, Youths, some
Adults) may not have FTL abilities, however, the trade off is that the largest
dragons (Ancients and some Elders) always have FTL
tug abilities (say 40-80 Mass at the least). As I said, I only toyed
with the idea and discarded it myself for the most part... but that's not to
say that you couldn't use it for some flavor... heck, I might even try it a
time or two.
As for the types of dragons, that's up to the player.. for the most part I
went with Western Dragons. As far as I know, there aren't many Eastern
dragons, if any, that have wings, and the number of limbs played a part in how
I came up with the rules... I think there should have been a followup post
that breaks down not only dragon ages but also mentions the types of dragons I
envisioned and the roles you would most likely see each type of dragon in. But
again, I suppose a player more
knowledgable on dragons from other cultures/regions could appropriately
designate their favorite types of dragons... and as I'm sure Jon T would
probably say... "if you don't like what something in the rules given, then use
whatever you do like!"
> Thomas Westbrook <tom_westbrook@yahoo.com> wrote:
Not a bad idea. Other Sci Fi Genres such as Star Wars (mostly the WEG RPG),
Star Trek, DIsney etc. have had some kind of "dragon". Space is full of races
and object uncharted, so Why not.
however, I am totally opposed to any psionic PSB entering the game
period -- That's what I liked about FT in the first place was no
psionics/tlelpathy etc.. Other Sci Fi backgrounds like BG, B5, ST, SW,
Traveller... have psionic PBS and there are generally no bounds for it excet
that it is "Morally wrong to do X" which doesn't really stop
anybody. the next thing will be 'dragon' players loading the up and
enhancing on the psionics and blasting everything on the board before the game
starts, so then what's the point of playing?
Dragon also need to add 'armor' as the scales (assuming they are reptilian)
harden. Also for clans, Will is be norse vs Medevil vs asian dragons?
> Rrok Anroll <coldnovemberrain_2000@yahoo.com> wrote:
C. Dragonets (fighters) and Clutches (hanger bays) are costed and treated like
human fighters instead of Sa'Vasku drones. D. The "Repair" pool is now renamed
to the "Healing" pool.
Limitations 1. Dragons have STRONG bodies, at least 40% of a dragon is body.
3. Dragons are limited to 1 "Cortex Node/FireCon".
Weapons 4. Empathic Blast: Dragons have a psi weapon that's similar to an EMP
beam. The blast effects all systems on a target, including core systems. All
systems take a threshold check and on a 5 are lost for 1 round, on a 6 are
lost for two rounds. All systems are rolled for once per die until a system
fails the check. Damage Control parties can be used as normal to negate the
effects.
I've also had a few thoughts about doing space whales...
I'll have these posted in a little while... by tomorrow definitely.. I was
actually working on writing them down when I had to reboot the system..
unfortunately the information wasn't saved soo... sucks cause I was almost
finished with them too... but probably by the end of the night I'll have them
up.
After seeing Moya and Talen from FarScape, please post your whale ideas. I'm
interested in reading them.
Doug said:
> All the pieces were the same soft poly-something plastic from which
there is
> a greasy feel to them, though I suppose that could be THICK mould
Probably polyethylene. Definitely need to prime it before you try painting,
and depending on the mix of plastics you may find the primer doesn't stick.
Ebay has one...
http://tinyurl.com/4553d
> On Sunday 12 December 2004 09:54 pm, Doug Evans wrote:
<<<snip>>>
> These are a little bigger than the Dragon Lords, I think, and a bit on