OK, some questions for the rules monkeys. *smile* these questions came up in a
game I played yesterday. We'll all ignore me chosing to shoot at the long
range Fighters instead of the Torpedo fighters (I'm dumb. I know).
1) Torpedo Fighters Torpedo Fighters only get one 'volley' before needing
rearming. How, if any, are they affected by CEF. We found it kind of well dumb
that they are effectively 'Fast' Fighters, because they get 5 turns of being
able to move at 36".
2) Launch/Recovery
It's hard to figure out the rules for Fighter Launch/Recovery. The
way we did it, was that Fighters were launched in the Move Ships (5) Phase, at
the midpoint of the ship's move. This meant that apparently, they only get to
secondary move that turn. Which seems contradictory to what is said in the
Turn Sequence in Fleet Book 2, which says they are moved before those already
in flight. Which means that if the ship is moving fairly fast, the fighters
seem to get left behind. And we had absolutely no idea where to have Fighters
'recover'. Or how it was handled. Several questions.
-How close do Fighters have to be placed at the point of launch?
We said 2mu(inches), but we had no idea.
-How close do Fighters have to be placed to land?
-Which phase do Fighters dock in?
-It seems that dogfights seem to favour the loser of the Initiative, if
the capacity to tie up Fighters is still in place. Is it?
3) Screening with Fighters. Fighters move in Phase 3, and then again in Phase
5, correct? Isn't it a little confusing using the term 'screen' when that is
already a defensive system?
4) Ordnance When shooting at Salvo Missiles, do Interceptors gain their
additional bonus to hit? Do Attack Fighters/Torpedo Fighters use
their penalties to hit? Do Interceptor Fighters gain the +1 against
Plasma Launchers?
5) Secondary Moves. In Phase 6, the Allocate Ordnance and Fighter attacks, it
lists Fighters wanting to do a secondary move last. Is it considered
- A Free Move (costing a CEF) done during the declaration of a
target.
- A move that invalidates it firing that turn (not seeming to gel with
other rules).
- All secondary moves done before declaration of Fighter Attacks.
The reason for the vagueness is the placement of the wording, and also that a
Dogfight stops a Fighter from moving. Can I secondary move IN to a dogfight?
Does it have any penalties (other than the 1 CEF?
6) Alternate Landings
Do Fighters have to launch/recover from their own ships? I know
Sa'Vasku can have Drones go from ship to ship as a means of healing, but it
doesn't seem to imply that other fighters can.
Would/should this add a penalty to the Re-Arming rule? Also, if
say an Inflexible Carrier (NAC) has two Torpedo bays, and two Interceptor
bays, and both Torpedo Bays are destroyed to damage,
can the Torpedo Fighters Re-Arm in the Interceptor bays? Vice
Versa?
7) Morale Assuming Question 6 is a no, has anyone experimented with Morale
modifications for the effects of having a Fighter group's Carrier destroyed?
Assuming Question 6 is a yes, has anyone experimented with Morale
Modifications for the effects of having more squads than remaining bays in the
Carrier Fleet? It was just discussed, that if a Fighter squad hesitates when
it takes casualties, it might also, if it realises it can not get home.
I can answer some of them.
1. Torpedo fighters only get 1 "volley" with their antiship weaponry. Remember
that leaves them with 5 CEF and limited antifighter capacity. This can be
useful to tie up enemy squadrons in a dogfight and may even kill a few.
2. Fighter launch is a bit odd now, but usually doesn't come up, as you can
start the game with fighters launched. The fighters have to be within
2" for launch/recovery and are recovered as soon as it is declared they
are being recovered. Fighters running away from a dogfight still get
slaughtered (free shots), but you could implement a rule that as long as there
is still 1 squadron in contact with the enemy, they don't get the free shot
(keep'em too busy to chase you).
3. Screening fighters must have started the turn within 2" of the ship they
are escorting. They can either move normally in the Move Fighters phase OR
when the ship it is escorting moves. Not both. It can expend endurance as
normal after this to move away.
4. Against salvo missiles/plasmabolts etc, fighters always use
their
antifighter values; so interceptors get their +1 and attack/torpedo get
their "1 kill on 6" roll.
5. You've got secondary moves right. They're done during ordinance phase, when
the fighter declares it's own target. You can secondary into a dogfight if you
weren't within the 6" you needed to initiate it. Fighters can expend 2 CEF
here (1 to move, 1 to attack).
6. Fighters don't have to recover to their own bay, but you can only rearm
them in a matching bay. PSB is that the bays don't have the munitions
/ repair equipment that matches. Although the fighter types are
generally
semi-modular (variable mission to mission) it's not really within the
scope of game to reconfigure during combat to a new mission (unless you want
to do some special rules up). Sa'vasku are a special case, as they reabsorb
the fighters before growing a new group to "rearm" them. It was discussed
several months ago that drones are a fast repair option. Starts to smell a
little, but valid if you really need to apply it. However, when you look at
the rules, they can only
replace biomass the ship has expended itself (for repairs/pod launchers
etc.)
7. Using fighter Morale is enough of a penalty in itself, without applying
further modifiers.
Neath Southern Skies -http://home.pacific.net.au/~southernskies/
[mkw] Admiral Peter Rollins; Task Force Zulu
[DitD] Captain Puppilier
> -----Original Message-----
> 3. Screening fighters must have started the turn within 2" of the ship
Actually its 3";)
:D
Close enough. :-)~~~
I don't have my books with me, so I'm working from memory.
Neath Southern Skies -http://home.pacific.net.au/~southernskies/
[mkw] Admiral Peter Rollins; Task Force Zulu
[DitD] Captain Puppilier
> -----Original Message-----
> --- Morgan Vening <morgan@optushome.com.au> wrote:
XXX Your comment actually sparked an idea!
(Using house rules) The Torp-ftr could be
allowed to use its endurance for 1-6 point
(1D6) attack of 2-3 point(1D3) attacks.
The attacks use up endurace based on the strength of the attack. XXX
...
...Several
> questions.
XXX We normally use base to base contact for everything. XXX
...
> 6) Alternate Landings
...
> Would/should this add a penalty to the Re-Arming
XXX Logic dictates that the bays are identical
as they have the same mass and cost. Only the
fighters are different types, and in most cases the servicing requirements are
the same.
Only the Torp-ftr is different as it is considered
to have expendable ordinance. It is the same as saying the 48th frt sq is in
bay one, the 17th heavy-ftr is in bay 2, 22nd
torp sq is in bay 3 and 66th Fast-ftr is in bay 4.
The 48th standard, the 17th heavy and the 66th fast have the same
replentishment requirements and could use each others bays if required. I
would suggest you consider a house rule if this is a problem. XXX
> 7) Morale
XXX The other side of the coin is; Since you will die in space anyway and
these B******* just killed all your friends, might as well make them pay! XXX
> Morgan Vening
Bye for now,
> -----Original Message-----
[snip]
> > 7) Morale
-----End Original Message---------
Yes and no. Just because the carrier is dead does NOT mean that the fighter
PILOTS are unrecoverable. I think that it would be appropriate to have some
morale check, especially if enough carriers are lost such that all of the
remaining fighters may not dock.
House Rule for Loss of Carrier: If a carrier is lost (carrier, here, is any
ship with a fighter bay), the fighters assigned to that carrier make morale
checks as if there is 1 less fighter in the group. Additionally, if there are
less fighter bays in the fleet than fighter groups, all fighters make morale
checks as if the fighter group has lost one additional fighter. A roll of 1 on
the fighter morale check always succeeds. Example: Fighter group A has 4
fighters left. It looses its carrier to fast strike boats. However, due to
fighter attrition, there are enough fighter bays in the fleet to hold all the
remaining fighter groups. An additional fighter bay is lost to a needle
attack. This leaves more fighter groups than fighter bays, all fighter groups
make a morale check as if they had lost 1 additional fighter (FG A would now
check as if it had 2 fighters).
House Rules for Returning Fighters with No Bay: If fighters must return due to
empty endurance or failing a morale check 3 times, and there are no fighter
bays to receive it (all full or none left), roll a d6. Results:
1-2) Fighter Pilot ejects in life pod and awaits rescue.
3-4) Fighter flies parallel to a friendly ship and awaits
rescue.
5-6) Fighter screens ship until end of battle or a bay
opens up
Now, the above house rules slow down the game and may be too severe. Most
likely the fighter morale rules are sufficient as they stand. The above is
presented if you wish to add some additional flavor to a scenario.