> Laserlight wrote:
> > >so, the nac-as-a-whole symbol is the crown, and the following
Yep. The French called the English lions "leopards" as an insult, and the term
stuck.
> > >scotland - lion rampant / thistle
Yes. The Lion Rampant is the personal arms of the Scottish king, not of
Scotland.
> > >wales - dragon
No way! A heraldic wyvern has only two feet, a dragon has four - and the
red dragon of Wales most certainly has four feet on all Welsh flags I've ever
seen.
> I suggest a blue field. The crown, leopards, harp, eagle, fleur de
The Welsh national arms is unheraldic already - per fess argent and
vert, a dragon gules (don't remember the correct term for the dragon's pose);
the dragon is placed squarely over the division, so half of it is on the
green.
> Perhaps instead a canton (upper left quarter) can be changed to the
This would solve the problem with the red symbols, yes.
Regards,
***
No way! A heraldic wyvern has only two feet, a dragon has four - and the
red dragon of Wales most certainly has four feet on all Welsh flags I've ever
seen.***
Right-o. I have one on my chest even as I type this. (T-shirt, not
tattoo.)
There's one on the cap insignia of the Welsh Borderers. A re-enactor
tried to tell me it was a griffon. 'Look, this is a muzzle, not a beak. This
chest is covered in scale bands, not feathers...' 'But the book sez...' Basic
read, don't think.
***
> I suggest a blue field. The crown, leopards, harp, eagle, fleur de
The Welsh national arms is unheraldic already - per fess argent and
vert, a dragon gules (don't remember the correct term for the dragon's pose);
the dragon is placed squarely over the division, so half of it is on the
green.***
Isn't the phrase 'en passant'? Standing on three legs, one raised. I'm not up
on heraldic forms; had no idea the colors were a problem. However, I seem to
recall the term a surprise, as I'd seen it in chess.
I'm still nerved about trying to do small details on ships, but an 'y draig
goch' would probably be unavoidable. ESU was always a temporary fleet until I
got my NAC going. This has definitely got me excited again. And, maybe the
words 'Cymru am beth' scrawled on a smaller ship.
KR? I think I'm going to need a carrier... ;->=
Oh, I have some old Gren K-force women-in-power-armor, painted green.
The shoulders have what appear to be lions, but I had them painted red with
wings, and I call the insignias dragons. Still no telling whether they'll
play non-standard 40K or SGII first.
The_Beast
> On Tue, 27 Oct 1998, Oerjan Ohlson wrote:
the unicorn is the bearer of the royal arms which represents scotland, but
again it's fallen into disuse as a general symbol. i stand by the thistle
on the grounds that it's on the scots-design one pound coin.
> > > >wales - dragon
re my earlier comment on pedantry: pedantry is good *if correct* :-)
> > Perhaps instead a canton (upper left quarter) can be changed to the
i don't think we need to worry too much about preserving the colour of the
symbols - it is the shape which really matters; a gold crown with a red
maple leaf or dragon is just going to be a pain (and never ever heraldically
correct unless you put them on different parts, yech). i sez we should have
all symbols in gold, on a white or coloured background according to use. on
paper, it could equally be black on white. engraved, it would just be outline.
Tom
> Oerjan Ohlson writes:
Passant?
> the dragon is placed squarely over the division, so half of it is on
Just to be pedantic, the dragon is the Welsh Flag, but it isn't the Welsh Arms
any more than the St.George's Cross is the arms of England or the St.Andrews
Cross is the arms of Scotland.
The heraldric arms of Wales consist of a quartered field, red and yellow, each
quater with a rampant lion respectively yellow and red. To be honest, I forget
whether the first quarter is red or yellow, but you get the idea.
The Welsh flag derives from the battle standard of Henry Tudor, consisting of
his badge (a red dragon... a cheap propaganda ploy whilst marching through
Wales on his way to win a crown at Bosworth Field) and his livery colours of
green and white.
I'm surprised that the Tudor Rose has not been mentioned as an
English badge. I'm not sure what our current merry band of Saxe-
Coburg-Gotha-Battenburgs have as a badge, if anything.
> > Perhaps instead a canton (upper left quarter) can be changed to the
There's a proper heraldric term (that I've forgotten) for a
coloured border around a charge to outline it and prevent the no-
colour-on-colour-no-metal-on-metal thing. The only example that I
can think of is Malta's flag... the George Cross is silver on a white
("silver") background, but has an outline of red to keep it square with the
heralds.
> devans@uneb.edu wrote:
> The Welsh national arms is unheraldic already - per fess argent and
Passant. En Passant is the chess term.