Sometime soon, I want to try running my FMA Zombies game again. As with the
last time I ran it (back in November), I've got a few problems to overcome....
Firstly, there's number of players. I'm planning on eight, which is about as
much as I think my brain can handle without exploding.
Secondly, these eight or so players will have -- for the most part -- no
experience with the system.
Now, the last time I ran this game it went pretty well...but it was slow, very
slow. We only got a handful of turns in, not nearly enough to really resolve
the game. I'd like to keep things moving quickly, keep the players on their
toes, make them say "Man, I've got to buy me some GZG products from the nice
guy who owns this here store that we're gaming in!"
So, any advice for someone wanting to run a large game? Tips, tricks,
brilliant ideas?
G'day,
> So, any advice for someone wanting to run a large game?
- limit the number of figs per player to about 3 (if that's too few
zombies then just have more appear once a guys 2 or 3 have been killed off)
- cheat sheets with the info needed to play on them (weapon stats
usually
and any other crucial info you don't want to look-up/repeat a zillion
times)
- colour coded dice (yellow D4s, green D6s etc)
they're the things we've found help speed up play most
From: John Crimmins johncrim@voicenet.com
> I'm planning on eight, which is about as much as I think my brain can
Brain exploding = good special effects. However, I think you'd find 4-6
would do better.
> no experience with the system. ...I'd like to keep things moving
FMA specific: Make up a reference sheet (like the SG2 one). Color code dice
(yellow d4's, blue d8's etc)
General: Recruit a player to be assistant GM, move the the minions, roll the
dice and resolve attacks, while you provide plot, characterization and special
effects.
Feel free to override the rules in the interest of drama. Stuart's CineGrunt
games are a good example. The news crew had the ability to teleport, for
example, so they could interview (ie, interfere with, irritate and embarass)
the other units without bothering to plod across the board.
All games are role playing games.
Be loud, be enthusiastic, be dramatic. Be odd. Would you rather watch
Father Bob, generic priest of a non-specific, vaguely good diety--or
Heruzar, wild-eyed priest of Vulcan, scarred from fires and explosions
and sworn to use no weapon twice in the same battle (which means the first foe
got an exploding horseshoe, the second one got the fire siphon, third one got
the hammer, fourth one got a portable anvil, etc)?
GOTO a different set of rules that is fast playing and will allow
each player to have 5-15 figures each.
RUN-RUN-RUN to your local store or mail order, CHAIN REACTION rules
from TWOHOURWARGAMESS!
these used to be call (and will still be called in Europe) GUNS AND GIRLS!
DO NOT BE A SUCKER and faint at the EURO cover (BAZOOMS,BUTTs, and
LEGS)-this is a tie with AMAZON MINIATURES new G AND G 28mm figure
line.
the USA cover is much more indictive of what is inside! (a target shot full of
bulletholes).
i playtested these rules and fought a batle involving 7 choppa chix vs 24 or
more zombies in a nowhereburg after the end of the world.
it works, and works well!
we also used these rules for soldier fighting bugs (starship troopers and
aliens), soldiers fighting rebels on a colony world, gangsters vs police in
the 1920s, escaped felons vs police during a routine
traffic stop, GIs vs Heer -including a Panther tank!- gangsters
fighting giant spiders in the mountains of rural America, time travellers vs
various opponents, soldiers fighting terorists, injuns
vs vaqueros, USN Yangtze Patrol vs Chinese warlord troops, and other
scenarios.
these rules are FUN! SIMPLE! FAST! and provide the toys with a mind of their
own at times!
highly recommended.
On Mon, 20 May 2002 21:28:59 -0400 (EDT), "John Crimmins"
> <johncrim@voicenet.com> wrote:
> Now, the last time I ran this game it went pretty well...but it was
FMA, like SG2, is a fairly slow game. Ten figures per side is about the
maximum you can expect to use and still have a game complete in two to three
hours unless you strip things out. I did a playtest with 6 figures per side
for a rule that Jon was asking about. It was played on a kitchen table with
buildings as the only cover. It used a new rule that Jon came up with having
to do with suppression. There was no time for overwatch or a number of other
things that could have slowed down the game. It took about 90 minutes to
playtest. The suppression rule Jon is working on actually speeds the game up a
bit.
If you want the game completed under, say, 3 hours, you'll need to limit
players to 2 or 3 figures each.
Look at it this way. If it takes a player, on average, even just 2 minutes to
resolve the actions of one figure, 15 figures on the table will take 30
minutes per turn (until figures start dropping). Now, of course, maneuvering
is much faster than that, but combat is slower. Plus there's all the table
talk, questions, running to the bathroom, etc.
If running with zombies, you might want to use the group activation rule. In
fact, you could enforce the group activation rule for the zombie player
(i.e.
they have not choice).
Another option is to play the game using SG2. I haven't tried giving one
player "squads" of individual figures and the other player regular squads, but
it might actually work.
On Tue, 21 May 2002 16:25:06 +1000, Beth.Fulton@csiro.au wrote :
> G'day,
Well, the plan is to give each player between two and four minis. The zombies
will be under GM control, and have the players badly outnumbered. Just another
day in Zombietown!
> - cheat sheets with the info needed to play on them (weapon stats
This I have done, up to and including scanned pictures of their minis, so
there is no question of who is who. Actual rule cheat sheets, on the other
hand, should be assembled soon. If nothing else, I want to make the various
activation options (move, combat move, shoot, transfer actions, etc.) clear to
the players.
> - colour coded dice (yellow D4s, green D6s etc)
That's a purchase that I've been forgetting to make. I'll have to remedy that
one next time I hit the shop. It's the little things that matter, innit?
On Tue, 21 May 2002 09:00:34 -0400, "laserlight@quixnet.net"
<laserlight@quixnet.net> wrote:
> From: John Crimmins johncrim@voicenet.com
This is an excellent idea, and I can even reduce the number of "living"
players by assigning zombies to some of them. Also, let the folks who are
killed off entirely start playing zombies....
> Feel free to override the rules in the interest of drama. Stuart's
Your ideas are intriguing to me, and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.
Seriously, that's an excellent idea, and I need to give it some serious
thought so that I can do it properly.
On Tue, 21 May 2002 10:03:22 -0500, Allan Goodall <agoodall@att.net>
wrote:
> On Mon, 20 May 2002 21:28:59 -0400 (EDT), "John Crimmins"
Really? I thought that my relative unfamiliarity (and my players' total
unfamiliarity) with the rules was what was slowing things down.
> If you want the game completed under, say, 3 hours, you'll need to
The plan is to have a total of about 50 figures on the board...but one of
these minis is the goal of the scenario, and about 40 more of them are going
to be zombies...who will, in fact, be moving as a group.
(A pack? What's the collective noun for a group of zombies, anyway? I think
that "a shamble of zombies" sounds pretty good.)
> If running with zombies, you might want to use the group activation
Also an idea. I'm kind of waffling between Stargrunt, FMA, and ShockForce
right now,
frankly. I've been making FMA more cinematic (and ShockForce-like) by
giving individuals abilities like "Quick Draw", "Sneaky", or "Sharpshooter".
Maybe I should just stick with FMA for the slightly more serious games, and
use SF for the sillier ones,
Hi John,
> Now, the last time I ran this game it went pretty well...but it was
Not to sound pedantic but... don't run FMA skirmish...
Not for a big game with all-new players. If I was going to run a game
of that size for new players (and frankly, when I run demo games at
conventions or stores, I like to keep them to 4 players or less, just so I
don't go mad), I'd do a Stargrunt game where each player gets to control maybe
2 squads, or a squad and a vehicle. And I'd leave out all of the "optional"
rules, and keep the equipment types and TO&E's simple. Then they get to see
the nature of the game, but it doesn't get bogged down in detail. FMA skirmish
is fun, but can have lots of detail. While the basic mechanics are simple,
it's like running a stargrunt game when you add on
all the extra stuff (off table arty, EW, etc etc) - slows the game down
a lot, and can be confusing for new players.
And, of course, you can't buy FMA skirmish yet... Only the lucky folks on
the test list have up-to-date versions of the game. If you're going to
do a demo in a store, you might consider demoing a game that the store can
actually stock, and use miniatures that they have "for sale".
Beyond that, perhaps consider creating and printing a "rules summary" card
with the basics of fire combat - keeping it *really* simple - for
players to refer to. Maybe one side can have the "how to shoot" instructions,
and the other could have a squad card for the squad or two that they are
running. That would include a quick description of how you calculate squad
firepower, etc.
I don't normally use squad cards because I've got all that stuff in my head,
usually, but I've played a couple of games run by Tom Barclay where he
supplied squad cards for all the units, and it could be a help for new
players.
Create a "story" for the scenario that is simple but fun, and gives a reason
for the players to care. And keep it simple so that the new players don't get
overwhelmed with surprises or whatever while they're still learning the
mechnaics.
********************************************
> On Tue, 21 May 2002 09:15:25 -0500 (CDT), DAWGFACE47@webtv.net wrote:
> RUN-RUN-RUN to your local store or mail order, CHAIN REACTION rules
The web site I found was:
http://www.angelfire.com/az3/twohourwargames/
Unfortunately, it doesn't look like they are set up to sell the rules right
now. It looks like anyone wanting to mail order the rules will have to wait
until at least next month.
> And, of course, you can't buy FMA skirmish yet... Only the lucky folks
No, they don't either. :-)
> General:
In fact, you could have each of the players also run a clutch of
zombies--particularly if you have two opposing teams of players.
Another thing you can do is assign an experienced player to be a team leader,
who can run a figure or so of his own but spends more time leading his team
and helping them resolve attacks. I was in three games
at ECC in which the GM picked a ruthless, pushy so-and-so to be the team
leader, and I thought it worked pretty well--no debates over "what do we
do now" or "who activates next".
G'day,
> Allan wrote:
Jon replied:
> Really? I thought that my relative unfamiliarity (and my
Personally I think it can depend on the players and how many of the rules you
choose to include. For example, in the games we've played with 3 squads on the
board (so about 24 figs) we've seen everything from 15 minutes to 3 hours...
it came down to the amount of gasbagging (or note taking) how many "option"
rules were in play, and what you were being required to do (and so how careful
you're being)
> FMA for the slightly more serious games, and use SF for the
I don't know in our list of FMA games we've included we've spanned "more
sensible" scenarios like
- 2 small military forces contact
- extraction
- strike on an outpost
- New Stalingrad
- amphibious landing
- boarding party
- local insurgents remove foreign armoury
but we've also played things like
- keep the flag
- black powder muskets vs AARs
- "greys" are coming to get you
- the skeletal horde has the princess in the tower and we must save her
(heroes with swords and magicians)
- pub brawl
- crap loads of bugs are overrunning our position
- big ugly monsters scrap to the death (ever wanted to know what happens
when a xenomorph runs into a trooper bug or a dragon?)
- cave clearing... oops was that a bug?
- pirate wars (swinging from the rigging)
- formula-one tanks
- dino hunts
- "action sequence" (think about all the corny movie things like chases
down hills, crocs in ponds underneath slippery logs you've got to teeter
across, the gapping chasm which you must cross by rope etc and then say "last
team standing wins")
- drug baron raid
- gang wars
- we may well be illegally fishing/mining/etc etc... what you gonna do
about it?
- 007 and the playgirl bunnies...
and a bunch of other ones the kids have come up with from time to time
(e.g.
animal wars... what would you do if you were a giraffe and a lion was looking
at you sideways?)
Cheers
Not to mention the popular Pirates games at each of the last two conventions.
Eight players each year with an average of 2 each year having played Stargrunt
or FMA. Both scenarios finished at or before the 4 hour time limit. The only
problem the first year was that the zombies were too darned slow!
I used about 6 figures per player. I would suggest keeping things simple,
though. One thing I've learned about both convention and role-playing
games is to keep things simple -- the players will add more than enough
complexity. The game can still be complex -- last years convention game
I give each side its own victory condition and had 4 players on a side. I then
gave each of the players their own objective in addition to the team
objective. This made for a lot of interaction while still allowing the game to
flow smoothly. (Kudos to my playtesters for helping me out with that
one!)
Nicholas Caldwell clcaldwell@kreative.net
[quoted original message omitted]
> --- Beth.Fulton@csiro.au wrote:
> and a bunch of other ones the kids have come up with
Run like hell.
Seriously, there's a nifty set of rule out somewhere
called Mammilian Mayhem, which is for 1800s big-game
hunting. Pretty cool and probably the first thing I'm going to convert to FMAS
when it's out.
After, of course, Byzantines both SF and Historical.
> At 01:26 PM 5/21/02 -0400, you wrote:
(My mail appears to be acting up; the messages I sent on Monday took nearly a
full day to be posted to the list. With luck, the curse will be lifted with
this one, which I am sending on Wednesday evening. If not, well, I blame
society.)
> Not to sound pedantic but... don't run FMA skirmish...
The general idea is to kick off a miniatures group that's going to meet once
or twice a month, hopefully drawing new players into the fold along the way.
Ultimately, the best thing to do is to run multiple games (the store in
question could support two, maybe three games at a time), but it's hard to be
sure how many people will be showing up at first. This in mind, I'm trying to
run something that will accomidate as many people as possible, while remaining
playable at the same time. Full FMA might not be the best choice for this, as
I'm starting to see.
> And, of course, you can't buy FMA skirmish yet... Only the lucky folks
This is an excellent point, frankly. Of course, of my two system choices, one
is OOP and the other is NYIP (Not Yet In Print), so I'm reasonably damned
whichever way I choose to go.
Story of my life, that.
> Beyond that, perhaps consider creating and printing a "rules summary"
card
> with the basics of fire combat - keeping it *really* simple - for
So noted; that's something for me to work on over the next few weeks.
> I don't normally use squad cards because I've got all that stuff in my
I always try to do this, and should have no problem with having these for the
game no matter *what* system I run. I tend to lavish far too much time on this
kind of frippery, as anyone who saw my squad card for Carnage Con Queso can
attest.
> At 11:54 AM 5/22/02 -0400, you wrote:
This gives me an idea or three, which I am frankly far too tired to properly
articulate. But it should keep the zombies moving, let the turns progress more
quickly, and ensure that no one is spending too long sitting around waiting
for his turn to move a figure. Hmmm....
> Another thing you can do is assign an experienced player to be a team
I expect a ruthless, pushy so-and-so, as it happens...but I suspect that
the hardest part of the game will be keeping myself from strangling him. But,
hey: I need to relax more, really.
> At 09:52 AM 5/23/02 +1000, you wrote:
I like the way you think, he said in deep admiration. I'm going to shamelessly
steal several of the above, I think.
> and a bunch of other ones the kids have come up with from time to time
Giraffe: "Are you preyin' on me? Are YOU preyin' on ME? Then who the hell else
are you preyin' on, huh?"
-- From Martin Scorsese's SAFARI DRIVER
G'day,
> I like the way you think, he said in deep admiration. I'm going to
Feel free... the more devious minds working on these kind of scenario ideas
the better;)
> Giraffe: "Are you preyin' on me? Are YOU preyin' on ME? Then
;)
Have fun
G'day,
> Run like hell.
<geek biologist mode on> Not always, mother giraffes stand a better chance by
staying in place and kicking the crap out of the lions... <geek biologist mode
off>
> Seriously, there's a nifty set of rule out somewhere
Cool. Who publishes it?
Thanks
> --- Beth.Fulton@csiro.au wrote:
> > Seriously, there's a nifty set of rule out
Sorry it took so long to reply.
http://www.hlbs.co.uk/rules.html
G'day,
> Sorry it took so long to reply.
No worries, thanks!