> Very roughly 650-750 pts per side, with your fleet at (IIRC) 710 pts.
Thats seems about right
> [snip]
sorry meant the total amount of damge from missles the guy who taught us said
to count up how many missle hits the roll PD and the roll dice for each missle
is that incorrect?
OK now Im really going to HAVE to order the rules:)
> This is *extremely* impressive SM shooting - you hit with every SM
They had pretty predicable plots yes and moved pretty slow <4 so t wasnt too
dificult
> That wasn't very smart of him, considering that your missile boats are
Yes they were
I agree I honestly was surprised (pleasently) when he did I wasnt going to
correct him til after the battle:)
> The lasting impression is that your opponents must fly either very
As stated earlier they moved noth slowly and very predictably the one time I
thought he would close too quickly is when I spaced them out
> 'Course, if you used Vector movement with 6" SM aquisition radius,
Yep I think you are correct at first it did seem a bit restrictive now Im not
sure because of the predicable movement they had could have offset that alot
Thanks for all your comments and suggestions it helps
there were 3 battles
2 with the 20 tonners 1 with the 30 tonners
battle 1
3 sides
side 1 was using 'German" ships
I believe he had a Battle cruiser and a dreadnougt
side 2 was 'Russian'
he had 4 frigates and a battleship/BC I believ
These ships are from the fleet book
side 3 was me
I had 10 20 toners
Westarted out about 50 inches apart
since the german was closer I advanced towards him slowly he was trying to
move more towards the other player as he thought he was the greater threatwe
were situated in kind of a triangle at about 40 inches I launched 10 salvoes
of missles at the germans 4 at the BC 6 at the dreadnought
It was about average dice so around 16 missles hit the BC I think 23 the
bigger ship He shot down about 4 to 6 from each salvo on slavo did over 72
points of damage (we stopeed counting at that point) the other around 50 or 60
both ships died
then I turn to the other squadron
shot 1 salvo at each frigate killing them
and then 6 at the BB
they died without loss of a single ship
batlle 2 I dont remember alot of details but
side one had a 'Foch' and acouple of cruisers side 2 (me) had a "US" carrier
and 14 missle boat
we used our fighters defensively as his strike came in he concentrated on the
big ship
we destroyed the fighters for some minor hull damage to the carrier (no
threshold rolls required) then we advance we still had 1 combat turn of
fighter endurance left
I advanced with the fighters close by me and launched at about 40 inches with
8 salvoes at the Foch and 3 each for the cruisers the FOch survived but the
cruisers died (the player still had a couple of aquadrons of fighters he had
used defensively stopping some of the missles) then our remaining fighters
closed and I fired my last salvo all 14 at the Foch as the fighters got within
range it died quickly
battle 3
around 1500 points
he had
1 "US" CV Valley FOrge I believ and 2 battle dreadnoughts for 8 fighter
squadrons he also had 2 'russian' frigates to fill out his points
I had 14 30 tonners with 14 fighters squadrons embarked
he launched all his fighters at me (he assumed my ships were just bigger,
tougher missle boat he didnt know about the fighter squadrons) as they closed
I launched my fighters and went out to meet them
he destreoyed 4 squadrons of my fighters I killed about 6
then his fighters hit my ships he killed one then my fighters destoyed them
so I had about 10 squadrons left with 1 combat turn and 13 ships I waited
until I was within about 40 inches and then closed witht the fighters as my
missle salvoes went out 7 salvoes at the CV and 6 at one of the battle
dreadnoughts I split my fighters between them as well the CV getting more
attention it was over in that salvo for the CV and battle dreadnought but not
all my fighters had fired yet (I saved about 3 squadrons)
he had started closing on my ships with his frigates so the next turn I
salvoed 3 missles at each widely spaced in case he accelerated so hopefully at
least 1 salvo would hit and the other 7 and fighters attacked the battle
dreadnought The frigates each got hit with 2 salvoes and the battle
dreadnought got about 5 plus fighters none survived
I hope this helps
The only time I was concerned was when the frigates close because my fighters
didnt have time to turn around and intercept them so I spread my salvoes out
so that the missles would almost have to hit
A somewhat late reply:
> there were 3 battles
> side 2 was 'Russian'
> These ships are from the fleet book
Very roughly 650-750 pts per side, with your fleet at (IIRC) 710 pts.
[snip]
> at about 40 inches I launched
Not clear what you mean here. If you say that one ship took over 72 pts
of damage and the other 50-60 pts that seems reasonable; but a *single*
SM salvo can't inflict more than 36 damage (6 missiles on target, none shot
down and all rolling 6 for damage).
> shot 1 salvo at each frigate killing them
This is *extremely* impressive SM shooting - you hit with every SM
salvo, which suggests that your opponents flew straight ahead. The NSL can't
do much else, of course, but the ESU frigates aren't easy targets (and the BC
has at least some ability to dodge SMs).
> batlle 2 I dont remember alot of details but
> side 2 (me) had a "US" carrier and 14 missle boat
> we used our fighters defensively as his strike came in he concentrated
> on the big ship
That wasn't very smart of him, considering that your missile boats are
much easier to intercept (being Thrust-1 compared to Thrust-4) and much
easier to kill... and more dangerous to his Foch, as well. 'Course, that
assumes that your missile boats were within reach, but it sounds as if they
were.
The lasting impression is that your opponents must fly either very slowly
or in very predictable paths (or both), or else you're a mind-reader :-/
I've never seen that high a percentage of SM salvoes on target (*all* salvoes
in the first two battles?!)... IIRC the best I've ever seen was 50% on target.
'Course, if you used Vector movement with 6" SM aquisition radius, that'd
explain a lot as well. There's a very good reason for the "strong
suggestion" that you use 3" SM aquisition radii against Vector-moving
ships :-/
Regards,
Clarence,
I wanted to make this an open letter of thanks and excuse. ;->=
Wanted to thank you for going to the trouble of giving us the details on your
battles so far. I'm sure they've been opening up eyes, both your's and our's.
And, hope you see I had an excuse for pestering you for those details. It's
obvious there's a lot of love for the rules, real attempts to fix errors and
defense against imagined errors from mis-reading.
Oh, and yes, you really must get copies of the books. ;->=
You've done admirably so far without them, tho'...
The_Beast
PS. To those going to Genghis Con in Denver, while it was looking dicey for a
bit, and the weather IS being a poopyhead, look for the long
haired/beardy old
guy, and I'll trot out me lil ESU flotilla.
> cgray wrote:
> >Not clear what you mean here. If you say that one ship took over 72
us said to count up how many missle hits the roll PD and the roll dice for
> each missle is that incorrect?
Basically correct, but the term "salvo" in the Salvo Missile rules refers
specifically to one single 6-missile/2-Mass (or 3-Mass, for ER)
"magazine slot". Each PDS can only engage one such salvo, so you shouldn't add
all
on-target missiles together until you've resolved PD fire.
In this battle, in rule terms one ship was hit by 6 salvoes (and took a
total of 72+ damage) while the other was hit by 4 salvoes (and took
50-60
damage) rather than each ship being hit by one salvo each - thus my
confusion.
> >This is *extremely* impressive SM shooting - you hit with every SM
GACK! <4 isn't "pretty slow". IMO <4 is "immobilized", regardless of what
movement system you're using.
As a rule of thumb I fly at speeds of 3-6x Thrust rating in Cinematic
movement and at speeds of 2-4x Thrust in Vector movement... and I prefer
thrust-6 or faster ships :-/ I know most people on the list fly at lower
speeds than I do, though.
Later,
> At 09:53 AM 2/11/99 -0600, you wrote:
I appreciate it I really do
> Wanted to thank you for going to the trouble of giving us the details
Yes they have opened mine at least:)
> And, hope you see I had an excuse for pestering you for those details.
It's
> obvious there's a lot of love for the rules, real attempts to fix
I understand I play alot of wargames/sci-fi games and it helps to fix a
problem if there is one if you know the circumstances surounding it
> Oh, and yes, you really must get copies of the books. ;->=
Yes we only had one copy and so I really couldnt read them very well and they
told me their interpritaion of them
> You've done admirably so far without them, tho'...
Thanks one does ones best
> Basically correct, but the term "salvo" in the Salvo Missile rules
"magazine
> slot". Each PDS can only engage one such salvo, so you shouldn't add
OK here is how 2we did it tell me if this is correct allocated launch in
plotting then placed on table top within 36" of launchers then we both moved
we calculated how many salvoes would hit then he divided his PD fire between
the salvoes then we added up all the missles that would hit and started
rolling damage I stopped at 72 pts (he was destroyed by then) with some more
rolls to go
> In this battle, in rule terms one ship was hit by 6 salvoes (and took a
Ah yes many salvoes not just one:)
> GACK! <4 isn't "pretty slow". IMO <4 is "immobilized", regardless of
I think now everyone understands my quandry (at least a little anyway)
which is why I wanted some help/clarification it just seemed way to easy
to blow them apart with missles
> cgray wrote:
> OK here is how we did it tell me if this is correct allocated launch
fire between the salvoes
and resolved the PD fire
> then we added up all the missles that would hit and started rolling
rolls to go
Sounds correct, yes.
> >GACK! <4 isn't "pretty slow". IMO <4 is "immobilized", regardless of
[snip]
> I think now everyone understands my quandry (at least a little anyway)
Yes, I quite understand what happened. Don't worry - when your opponents
learn to maneuver, the SM efficiency is very likely to drop fast.
Regards,
> Clarence,
It's
> obvious there's a lot of love for the rules, real attempts to fix
Bummer! There I was, carrying around a 1500 point fleet (only Friday night,
though), and I didn't even know to look for you! Drat!
(Short-haired, fortyish, carrying a large, white mini box and a
green camo parka.)
- Sam