AMERICA, RIGHT OR WRONG?
friend you could not be further from the truth here.
i am an America. i am proud of it. I have fought for it. and when i was a
soldier, i swore my OATH TO THE CONSTITUTION, not to any person living or
dead.
but i do not believe wrong is right just because it is done by an AMERICAN.
wrong is wrong.
neither does the US ARMED FORCES, and there are provisions for
prosecuting those thar use the "i was just an office boy excuse" or
" i was just following orders excuse" used by the NAZI officers, politicians,
judges, rank and file after the war.
when i was in law enforcement, i served the public good and enforced the law,
but i was also without any civiil rights when it came to
citizen reviews or internal affairs investigations-someing guaranteed
the most scummy of perps.
but it went with the job. just like my OATH TO THE CONSTITUTION, and no
person, living or dead.
as far as what was done by others in the distant (100 years or more is my
private definition of distant), i had nothing to do with it, could not do
anything about it, and i can see wrongs quite clearly.
but i am not into PC or revisonist histories-pure rubbish as you would
say.
what was done 100 + years ago was done; we should remember it and
avoid repeating it, but should not waste time, money or tears over it or try
to re write events to make one party look worse than the other; the facts will
reveal who was in the wrong.
MOVE ALONG, MOVE ALONG.
our armed forces have done much more good than evil in this world during the
relatively short time of their existence, for uncounted millons of
non-Americans.
our nation too has done much more good than evl in this world during the
relatively short time of our existence, for uncounted millions of non
Americans.
and we as a people clean our dirty drawers in full view of the world as a
general rule.
all of the wailing and gnashing of teeth or claims to the countrary
will not change the fact that WE-the USA-are the modern world's ONE-
and- ONLY SUPER POWER.
and our day will come when we are surplanted by another SUPER POWER-that
is the way things work.
BUT, until, then, when the crap hits the fan in someplace you never heard of
or wanted know about, UNCLE SAP sends money, medicine, shelter, food,
clothing, even soldiers, sailors, airmen, and marines, at the will of the
AMERICAN PEOPLE and the AMERICAN PRESIDENT.
INTERESTING DISCUSSION, SZABO, and not one comparative pee -pee on
display either.
and i congratulate you for providing the info about scalping
bounties-did not think you would do so.
but remember, the Amerindians were not ever pastoral, tree hugging, kissy
faced and etc. they were killing each other before the first european or
chinise evr wandered ashore....
a fact that tends to be lost in the PC shuffle nowdays.
y'all have a nice day!
Dawg said:
> What was done 100 + years ago was done; we should remember it and
And it would be a little difficult to find a group/nationality/etc who
didn't raid/invade/pillage their neighbors when they could get away with
it. The fact that we can more easily document, oh, 1830's Americans vs
Africans, or Scots vs English, than we can Magyars vs Bohemians, or Cherokee
vs whoever their neighbors were, means only that we don't know much about the
latter, not that they didn't happen or weren't just as unjust.
Someone (a Swedish institute IIRC) said "In all the last 6000 years, there
have only been 50 years for which we have no record of a war being fought." My
comment on hearing that was "So what happened to the records for those years?"
> laserlight wrote:
> Someone (a Swedish institute IIRC) said "In all the last 6000 years,
I don't want to get into the arguement regarding America's (Or any nation for
that matter) sins and virtues, but Laser's comments ring sadly true about
humanity in general. IIRC, it was Gore Vidal who said that history is a record
of "The bloody migration of tribes."
3B^2
--- "laserlight@quixnet.net" <laserlight@quixnet.net>
wrote:
> And it would be a little difficult to find a
Excellent point! And I, in fact, am right now in the process of exploring the
possibility of a lawsuit against Italy, due to the fact that my ancestors (the
Germanic barbarians) were oppressed by the Romans during the age of the Roman
Republic and Empire. I plan on using that great historical work "Gladiator" as
evidence to support my claim, and look forward to winning a judgement
numbering in the thousands of lira (which should equate to about USD $.50,
minus lawyer's fees).
> Mark Reindl wrote:
> Excellent point! And I, in fact, am right now in the
I'd consider similar action based on the oppressed status of my own ancestors,
but since those ancestors included the English, Irish, Scots,
Welsh, Jews, Germans, White American Settlers, AND Cherokee, I'd end up as
both plaintiff AND defendant, and I can afford neither the lawyer's fees NOR
the settlement. ;-)
3B^2
gosh, two uncloaks in one week, this is a record for me...blame the two people
who gave me positive reinforcement and flakmagnet whose response was neither
positive nor negative, but appropriate nontheless.
Executive Summary: Rock On DAWG! See below for sound byte, knee jerk
responses.
> i am an America. i am proud of it. I have fought for it. and when i was
me too. I believe in the constitution, at least the inclusiveness and
interpreted spirit of it rather than the actual reasons for it's existence.
> wrong is wrong.
sorry, that's just wrong. wrong is right when wrong flies in the face of
injustice, I think that was pretty well ensconced as part of our culture by
the likes of Batman and Spiderman..
> what was done 100 + years ago was done; we should remember it and
I think the tears are not wasted, they remind us that we, too, are fallible,
frail, and human.
> or try to re write events to make one party look worse than the
the truth is defined by the one who writes the account and we cannot avoid
that interpretiveness of the account. Although I think it's important not to
silence a voice because we disagree with it.
> and we as a people clean our dirty drawers in full view of the world
I believe this gives us strength. I applaud the frankness of this statement,
even if we only really clean our socks when it is politically
important and beneficial to us.
> all of the wailing and gnashing of teeth or claims to the countrary
And, I ask, who cares?
> and our day will come when we are surplanted by another SUPER
word, brother!
> BUT, until, then, when the crap hits the fan in someplace you never
why is "he" a sap? I thought you loved this country, oh, that was sarcasm...
never mind.
> INTERESTING DISCUSSION, SZABO, and not one comparative pee -pee on
P P so there nyah nyah nyah
> but remember, the Amerindians were not ever pastoral, tree hugging,
I wish that were not true, I rather enjoy the romance of the Native American
Plight (That borders on distastefully racist and inelegant, but
I think Pocohontas was a hottie, anyway, so there, I'll insult everyone who
isn't short, fat, balding, white, and geeky like me, all the while respecting
their tall, thin, coiffured (sp?) colorful attractive selves)
> a fact that tends to be lost in the PC shuffle nowdays.
Didn't the Chicago Bears do a version of the PC shuffle? Woob Woob Woob
Woob! pick two! nyuck nyuck nyuck!
Somehow my interest in the list is renewed, I read no less than 50 emails
today! Woohoo!
> but i do not believe wrong is right just because it is done by an
I'm glad we agree on that.
> but it went with the job. just like my OATH TO THE CONSTITUTION, and
I have a stronger sentaments here. We should not repeat what we did to the
American Indians.
I had a history proffessor who said that true history is atleast 100 years
old, because events more recent then that are too charged politically.
> our armed forces have done much more good than evil in this world
I think the above two statements depends on who you are. While in general your
arguements are valid, some of those who have been harmed, have been severly
devastated. While we can't go back, hopefully we can stop making a lot of the
same stupid mistakes.
> all of the wailing and gnashing of teeth or claims to the countrary
I never said we weren't.
> and our day will come when we are surplanted by another SUPER
But after that day happens, would you want to see something insulting and
demeaning of everything that we were on the GZG mailing list? It's not that I
love the Soviet's. I don't; the exact opposite is true. But I do have a very
healthy respect for the amount of violence they could inflict, and that their
technology can still inflict. And I see nothing to be gained by encouraging
radical political parties in Russia.
As far as Iraq goes, how does removing Sadam Hussien from power increase the
security of the United States if the process of removing him results in an
Islamic Fundamentalist revolution in Saudi Arabia? It doesn't.
> BUT, until, then, when the crap hits the fan in someplace you never
Actually, there are very few place I haven't heard of, but I was never
normal...
> and i congratulate you for providing the info about scalping
I'm glad I surprised you.
> but remember, the Amerindians were not ever pastoral, tree hugging,
I am fully aware of that. But the Indians usually assimilated captured women
and young children, not slaughter them. The Indians considered each other as
humans; the Europeans and Americans did not consider the Indians as humans,
and treated them accordingly.
> a fact that tends to be lost in the PC shuffle nowdays.
Agreed.
> --- DAWGFACE47@webtv.net wrote:
> and our day will come when we are surplanted by
And on that day the world will know the error of condeming the ONLY nation of
the world with the courage to condem the wrongs that it has committed and the
timidness to not eliminate the wrongs of the world, when it had the chance.